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NBarden
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 11:42 am
Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...
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Help.
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It seems to work okay...

Deck:

Mana Base:

Calciform Pools x 2
Vivid Creek x3
Vivid Crag x2
Vivid Plains x2
Vivid Grove x2
Brushland x4
Shivan Reef x4
Shimmering Grotto x 4
Dark Depths

Overgrowth x4

Sorceries/Instants:

Cryptic Command x4
Wrath of God x4
Disintegrate x3

Creatures:
Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir x 3
Akroma, Angel of Wrath x2
Akroma, Angel of Fury x2
Numot, the Devastator x3
Lightning Angel x4
Bogardan Hellkite x2
Kamahl, Pit Fighter x2
Arcanis the Omnipotent x2

Planeswalker:
Jace Beleren

Sideboard:

Vigor
Dolmen Gate x2
Soulbright Flamekin x2
Pestermite x 4
Oblivion Ring x 3
Brigid, Hero of Kinsbaile x2
Wrath of God


I don’t quite know what the point it, but it seems to work decently. Very Happy Its some sort of denial/direct damage deck that cycles way to well.

Help?
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Felipe Musco
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:21 pm
Joined: 18 May 2006 Posts: 2434 Location: Florianópolis, SC, Brasil
NBarden wrote:
Deck:

Mana Base:

Calciform Pools x4
Fungal Reaches x4
Brushland x4
Shivan Reef x4
Dark Depths

You have way too few lands. Remember, unless you’re running Urborg, Dark Depths is NOT a land, since it does not add mana. Then, not only you have quite a small number of lands, but only 8 of them produce colored mana "right away". This is a HUGE problem, when decks tend to be as fast as possible. A single Pithing Needle on Calciform Pools can really wreck your strategy. This varies, but as a rule of thumb, try to pack 22 lands for aggro decks (going to 21 if it has a REALLY low curve, or to 23-24 if it has too many lands that come into play tapped, like Treetop Village) and 25 for control decks (going up to 26 if your deck is mana hungry but has no accelerators, or down to 24 if you have accelerators or the deck runs on a relatively low curve, it just needs to play some big spells every now and then)

Birds of Paradise x4
Soulbright Flamekin x2

You tend to list accelerators with lands, but remember they’re not. This is what causes your decks to run so few lands. Creatures are creatures, lands are much less vulnerable than them, so remember this. Accelerators can be taken into account, as I showed above, but never literally. Also, SOulbright Flamekin is a poor accelerator unless the trample-giving ability is good enough for the deck, it only accelerates from 6 to 8, and that’s already so much mana you won’t need an accelerator anymore in the first place, specially one as vulnerable as a creature. I’d just run Coalition Relic, Prismatic Lens or Mind Stone over him any day for acceleration.

Sorceries/Instants:

Cryptic Command x4
Spell Burst x2
Wrath of God x4
Disintegrate x2

I see another problem. You play Spell Burst, but can’t really ramp up the mana curve fast enough (remember, your "accelerators" die to your own Wrath of God, again being counterproductive, I’d run artifact accelerators over them) to make it good. Then, you run Cryptic Command, but has only 4 reliable sources of blue mana (not counting Birds, ’cause they tend to die as soon as your opponent notices they’re too important to your deck, and the storage lands are WAY too slow), and they require that you take damage each time, so it’s not a very good card to have around. If you want countermagic, run something cheaper/less painful, like Rune Snag.

Creatures:
Vigor x3
Akroma, Angel of Wrath x2
Akroma, Angel of Fury x2
Numot, the Devastator x3
Bogardan Hellkite x4
Brion Stoutarm x2
Kamahl, Pit Fighter x2
Arcanis the Omnipotent x3

Ok, let’s go slowly. YOu have a REALLY low amount of lands, and no "good" acceleration (since you’ll need to cast Wrath of God to stay alive a lot of times, thus killing your own accelerators), for a boatload of expensive creatures. This kind of build, even if more aggro-oriented, would need AT LEAST 24 lands. Then, you have 2 HUGE beaters in Akroma, Angel of Wrath. I wouldn’t run the red Akroma, as a LOT of decks are packing black removal, but since I can see her being mindly useful, perhaps keep 1. I like Hellkite here, but not Numot. He makes you tap out during your own turn, does not win you the game as white Akroma does most of the time, or like Red Akroma does against control decks (I’d keep the second in the sideboard), and is WAY too vulnerable to spot-removal, so I’d cut him right out. For the same combination of colors, you’d be better off running a set of Lightning Angels. Also, even though Hellkite comes at instant speed, I still doesn’t like him enough to make into the deck, since, well, you need to cut stuff to make room for land anyway. Vigor is one of the worst incarnations, and Brion is a win-more card in this deck, I don’t see you hurling too many stuff. You probably just wanted the lifelink, but it’s not that necessary. Arcanis will never hit play, so I’d run Teferi in his place (if HE doesn’t hit play, at least they tapped out, so the NEXT beater WILL hit play, otherwise, they can’t counter your stuff anymore until Teferi dies, so win-win card). Kamahl is just terrible.

Planeswalker:
Ajani Goldmane x2
Jace Beleren x2

I don’t think Ajani is suited for a control-ish kind of deck, so I’d leave him out. Jace is cool, but he’s more of a complementary card drawing engine against other control decks, sicne if you play him against aggro, you’ll draw 1 card and he’ll be dead, so I’d leave 3 Jaces in the sideboard, none in the maindeck. You should have better card-drawing options, like Tidings, Foresee, Mulldrifter, Careful Consideration, Ancestral Vision, etc.

Sideboard:

Vigor
Dolmen Gate x2
Soulbright Flamekin x2
Pestermite x 4
Oblivion Ring x 3
Brigid, Hero of Kinsbaile x2
Disintegrate

I’d rather we finish working on the main deck, to THEN check the sideboard
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NBarden
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:30 pm
Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...
I’m thinking of running Shimmering Grotto and cutting some Storage lands for the Vivid lands. I was going to drop Dark Depths and Soulbright for Shimmering Grotto, would that be a better mana generator?

Maybe some overgrowth as well.... Think

Oh, and in my testing, Arcanis hit the table quite often. I’ll cut the Hellkites for Lightning Angels.
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NBarden
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:45 pm
Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...
And then cut the Brion for Hellkites.

Mess of a deck cleaned up, hopefully my mana base is semi-operable now.

I did keep a couple Birds of Paradise, because they’re cool if they don’t get killed, and dropped a couple Wrath for more targeted removal like Disintegrate. That way, I won’t wipe out my accelerators that much.

Teferi looks cool, but I’m not convinced he’s better than Arcanis. Please explain? I see he eliminates summoning sickness, but I’d MUCH rather have cards in my hand.
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Felipe Musco
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:10 pm
Joined: 18 May 2006 Posts: 2434 Location: Florianópolis, SC, Brasil
Birds is an accelerator/fixer, so you need them early, either run 4, or run none. You NEED a set of Wrath of God to survive, lots of protection creatures and untargettable ones out there, Wrath gets rid of them all, no questions asked. For early game spot-removal, just run Condemn, easier on the mana curve. Storage lands are GREAT for costly decks, so I’d keep them. Vivid lands are just slow... Arcanis is a MUCH better creature than Teferi, but Teferi makes possible for you to run the big guns again, like Numot, since you can play them eot. But on your build, I don’t see the need, I wouldn’t run Teferi. Hellkite has flash, Akroma number 1 has haste, Akroma number 2 can’t be countered.
Problem with Arcanis is exactly that, he doesn’t have haste. WITH Teferi he’s good, since you can play him eot. Otherwise, he just gets countered/killed, so I’d much rather play a set of Careful Consideration, which can only be countered, being vulnerable to a much smaller array of decks. Not to mention it gives you cards early, when you need to pull ahead to stabilish control of the game, while Arcanis gives you cards WAAAAY too late, when it might not make a difference at all.
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NBarden
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:34 pm
Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...
I see. I guess I’m not used to what other decks are capable of (although you shoulda taught me a lesson last night...), so I missed the point about haste and flash.

The more I look at it, the more awesome a keyword Shroud is.

So, what Teferi does is he enables you to EOT a creature, so no summoning sickness, and then they can’t kill it until their main phase, meaning that you get to swing once with it before they can even do anything.

Also, all their counter spells are rendered null, because they can’t play them outside of the main phase, and you can EOT your creatures, whereas they can’t EOT their instants.

SWEETNESS! I’ll use Teferi. You have me convinced. I’ll drop 2 Vigor and a Birds of Paradise for Teferi and drop the other bird for another land, probably Vivid Creek.
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Felipe Musco
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:59 pm
Joined: 18 May 2006 Posts: 2434 Location: Florianópolis, SC, Brasil
And they can’t counter your counters as well, should you counter their removal. And while we’re at it, Teferi also shuts down suspended cards forever (they stay removed from the game!) (making Delay a good counterspell after all), and shuts down Madness. Oh, and the Hideaway lands.
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