Namarie (POLL)

[Smeagollum]

LR cannot be allowed to play, otherwise Elves could discard possessions as well...

and if you think about Gil-Galad... once again... he don't need two abilities... cancel the whole regroup ability... compare gil-galad to erland... elves are to powerful...

Sorry Olorin, but this is rabbish..
Why are you wining about elves constantly?

Believe me this is rare that I say this, because I don't like playing Elves, but it's not to powerfull... I think it's more that you lack creativity. It's only in your mind. I think Elves are balanced. If you do a little errata LR can be allowed to play. Oh wow, she's able to discard possesions. It just balance Elves against Shelob/web and Corsair decks. Just kill her and you don't have a problem with her.  And limiting Gil-glad's manouver or regroup-ability is allready big enough.

Now, I'm done with this discussion. You all know my opinion about it and about x-listing cards (which you should not do!!!!) and that opinion will not be changed. And I know enough others who agree with me.

CARDS ARE MEANT TO PLAY.. and if to powerfull then you take a look for a small repair.

[Ringbearer]

Namarie is obvious broken. Any card that kills outright several shadows shouldnt be allowed. Same with Lady Redeemed. You couldnt play Corsairs, Moria, Meatgrinder Sauron, #$&*@! even besiegers and dunland were off then... ururks were already weak and nazgul lost to glorfindel. What is left then?

I playe dthe Namariedeck vs troll swarm. Even with 3 trolls out none survived archery... and gil replays the entire shebang.

[Olorin]

Thanks Ringbearer!

@Smeagollum: I m not wining - I am just confused/I just don't understand why I have to explain the brokeness of the elves even if it is that obvious. Why don't you just say, "yes Olorin, you're right" or something like that... instead you defend the brokeness of elves and say it is balanced or can be balanced with small changes... this is not right.
I want to have a game which is balanced, fair and makes fun - just to enable ONE fellowship which is not to stop, destroy the game... and believe me... it is ME, who know... I know... of what I am speaking about... it was ME who participated the last official Decipher European Championship... guess the most common fellowship which was logically most likely to win... it was the overpowerd and broken Elves...
and I am far not the only one who thinks so... I am only one of very few player that post that here... but most of players I know think the same as I do... at the opposite only a few players seems not to aggree that (e.g. Elrohir and you)...
I would suggest to sleep overnight and look agian objective onto that several elven cards... I hope then you will also see that we are all right and these cards just destroy the whole game - coz they just aren't balanced and can only - if even - made balanced - but not by small repairs...

I didn't want the discussion about the x-list... I set this card on the x-list anyway... it would be forbidden on tournaments I organize anyway... independent of the poll here...

[MR. Lurtzy]

If Gil-Galad was given the errata "At the start of the regroup phase", and Namarie R-listed, what would be the problem? To me it seems you are dead set against fixing either of them.

[Gerontius]

Namarie and LR kill way to many decks. I hate condition discard of most kinds and few cultures have a reliable way to prevent key conditions from getting destroyed.

[SomeRandomDude]

Smeagollum and Olorin, please remember that each of you are both entitled to your opinion and do not have to agree with each other. With that in mind, can we have a civil discussion without accusing people of lying or dismissing their ideas as rubbish?

Take a step back and look at yourselves. You are going at each others throats over a game. And a game that is fully customizable to whatever house rules you want to play with. Is it worth the demeaning and condescension just because someone wants to play the game differently than you?

This can also go for other people who have been participating in the thread. You know who you are.

I'd hate to have to lock yet another thread because of your bickering.

[legolas3333]

you know my house rules make namarie a fellowship action... it helps a lot as shadow conditions last a turn at least which is enough for some to do their work

[Elessar's Socks]

Would errata be beyond the scope of Austrian format? Seems like the sentiments expressed here can apply to other formats as well. If we're going to be doing that sort of thing, maybe a TLHH format (based off the Austrian format or whatever) would be in order.

[Smeagollum]

Smeagollum and Olorin, please remember that each of you are both entitled to your opinion and do not have to agree with each other. With that in mind, can we have a civil discussion without accusing people of lying or dismissing their ideas as rubbish?

Take a step back and look at yourselves. You are going at each others throats over a game. And a game that is fully customizable to whatever house rules you want to play with. Is it worth the demeaning and condescension just because someone wants to play the game differently than you?

This can also go for other people who have been participating in the thread. You know who you are.

I'd hate to have to lock yet another thread because of your bickering.

Well, maybe you are right... I just don't like it that people wants to x a card, because they can't handdle it. And a lot of people gave enough space for a solution, but still the only thing I hear is x-listing. Come on the card was released 2 years ago... I never had any problems with it.
Somewhere the discussion is at an end and for me that is now.

By the way, maybe my words are bit rough, but there is no intention about quaraling. It's more simplic and direct (I'm very direct, sorry guys, but that's who I am) and just say or write what he thinks and believe me that's not the easiest way!
I actually like the guy (for so far as i know him), like I like all of you (Sounds Bilboish somehow). If he feels how do you say it.. atacked or something.. don't be.. I'm just done with a discussion over x-listing cards.. nothing personal.

On but oftopic. If you all decide to x cards then I cann tell you the view of Amsterdam players: We will not follow you in that. Restricting = ok, making something unique is okay. Errata is okay. Even creating or changing a rule is ok. But that's where it ends. The cards are meant to play and to have fun with. Just look at yourself everyone. I am absolutely sure that all of you people use own errata's on cards, changed rules (austrian format is the biggest example). Everything is better then x-listing, because don't you all want to play all the cards?

[Ringbearer]

I feel X-ing is easier than errata's. Errata's are harder to remember, as you have to play acard in another way as is written. Especially as there is no central organ of rules for LOTR anymore, its hard to keep track about errata's.

[Smeagollum]

is the easy wat the just way?

[sickofpalantirs]

Simply put, yes. 
If you really feel a need to discard conditions, use Seclusion.

[Elrohir]

is the easy wat the just way?

What does this mean?

[TheJord]

This whole thread is turning into a circus.

I STRONGLY recommend you stick to the following guidelines for the remainder of this thread

1) Cast your vote
2) Voice your opinion in relation to your vote
3) Leave any personal opinions about the wider pros and cons of Namaire for another time

[Imrahil]

well, as some of you know, The Old Took and I don't play anything beyond Bloodlines, so we don't have to deal with Namarie or Gil-Galad, but we do have an opinion about LR.  Basically we see her as an answer to the corsair problem (corsairs= instant kill to possession dependant decks, and destroy anything that doesn't have possession removal).  Some of you may argue this, but I personally have to build all my decks with the question "How will this match up against Corsairs?" running through my mind.

But the Old Took and I are considering banning LR anyway, because she is too effective against too many shadows.  For us, it takes the fun out of the game when we are forced to resort to a couple of decks, instead of the whole range of LOTR TCG.

It appears that Namarie/ Gil-Galad is a combo with causes the same situation.  And it is GilGalad which is causing the problem, as someone else mentioned earlier.  Get rid of him, and Namarie is a good card still, but not the supernaturally awesome power it is with the high-king.  Of course, there are positives and negatives, good things and bad things that can be said for both positions, but the fact remains that any card which dominates the meta as much as the High King has, is not really worth having around.

My vote is X-List