Next Updates for the Hobbit Draft Game

[Durin's Heir]

I'm sorry for this absence. And much sorrier for the current situation in your country, my good fellow...

- Savage Warg: Alright.

- Underground Lake: Perhaps there'll be enough room for "discard pile" if you change "The One Ring" for "a Ring", and "(limit once per player)" for "(limit 1 per player)".

- His Wrath Was Redoubled: You say that your version will be played at a double move from 8 to 9, but that depends a lot on Smaug. If Bard can't kill him, Smaug will follow your trail to site 9 (which is a really hard double move). If Narzug did a good previous job, Smaug will have total freedom to discard his own fellow minions to ditch your important FP defenses like Sting, Dori or Orcrist (which is a much harder double move). Even if Bard is totally healthy, Smaug can often sacrifice himself to discard Dori or Sting... All in all, in the same scenario where Barrels would discard those minions that fuel Smaug's discarding, this event will often be trying belatedly to discard minions that were already discarded by Smaug, in which case it'll be totally useless. All that I try to do with my version is to provide a new utility at site 9.

You're right, my version is hard to read for inexperienced players. And it's better to discard followers (the idea of cards was only to reduce card lines). Correcting those 2 points, my version would look like this:

"Spell.
If the fellowship moves during the regroup phase (or if a skirmish ends at a battleground), discard Beorn (or 2 followers) to discard up to 2 minions not assigned to skirmish (except Smaug)."

The only gameplay difference with your version is that can be played at a skirmish at site 9 (or at a forced battleground), where as said before it'll only discard immediately before fierce-skirmishes. Besides that, it uses 6 lines (1 for "spell", and 5 for the rest), which requires to either remove "spell" or reduce the lore text. Or to keep the "spell" keyword, but using the rest of that 1st line with game text (like Wizard Storm)...


- Pity: Lore of Imladris can heal some wounds, yes. But if the new card supplies some healing for Bilbo, you'll be able to use better 3 of the 5 original cards (Contract, Negociator and Old Thrush). If that card recovers things from discard, you'll be using more and better 4 of the original 5 cards (Negociator, Old Thrush, Accorn and Barrels). So the key is then to heal Bilbo ONLY (Lore of Imladris will help the Dwarves). And to recycle cards.

Yes, Phial Star-glass is really mighty. I fear too mighty for this limited card pool. I agree that Smaug is supplementary mostly, but if the Shadow didn't do much harm before site 8 he can kill or weaken companions, just before the final strike. And Star-glass can stop Smaug's skirmish potential only, leaving his vitality untouched for his regroup skill to start discarding your things: Sting, Old Thrush, Burglar's Contract, Dori... Again, I believe discard is the main weakness of this pack, and An Invisible Ring does nothing to counter it, and might even be deepening it that way (however, Barrels can reduce Smaug's fuel)...

Orkish Aggressor can put pressure on Bilbo, but Bilbo should be clearing doubts well with the Accorn.

[-Enola-]

The situation is very sad .

I will playtest these 3 cards (Underground Lake, HWWR and Invisible Ring), but I'm not sure they will change (or maybe HWWR for a simple maneuver event?).

No other thoughts on the other cards? I can print them?

[Durin's Heir]

The situation is very sad .

No other thoughts on the other cards? I can print them?

I reviewed all again, and found no problems at all.

But don't forget to include the changes of lore text (see this specific post) and the symbol/year in the bottom right corner (remember it must be 2016, and also all new versions of Bilbo must be "A" instead of "(1)", because were modified). After that, all should be OK to print them...

At the bottom right corner, there's also a rectangle where Decipher included the card's set, rarity and number. Perhaps your cards will need a code like "2 D 3" (that would be "set 2, supplementary pack D, card #3 of that pack", it's only a rough idea ). In order to index and identify them better in Gemp (and possibly in a HDG card Wiki).

I will playtest these 3 cards (Underground Lake, HWWR and Invisible Ring), but I'm not sure they will change (or maybe HWWR for a simple maneuver event?).

Try to playtest your HWWR against Smaug + a shadow that survives well until regroup. And try to playtest both versions of the event and HWWR, if is possible.

- An Invisible Ring: I just noticed, Bilbo wearing The One would be nullifying Sauron's game text (both Sauron and Bilbo can't be assigned by The Necromancer, so it's easy for the FP player). Which goes against the story. I think it should exclude Sauron, and perhaps the Nazguls too as they "lived" in the Twilight World: "...remove the game text ... from a minion skirmishing him (except Sauron and minions) and make...".

- His Wrath Was Redoubled: I'll be thinking about a simple maneuver spell. Perhaps this:

"Discard Beorn (or 2 followers) to make an opponent assign 3 wounds to minions (except Smaug). At a battleground, you may assign those wounds instead."


Hope this helps.

[-Enola-]

After some tests, I change Dragon's Malice and Wrath of the Dragon. Smaug was not a good doubt machine, I hope it's ok now.

I take your idea of His Wrath Was Redoubled, but in assignment phase .

I didn't change An Invisible Ring, the text is long enough.

[Durin's Heir]

- His Wrath Was Redoubled: Assignment phase... even better! It has a small miswording in the title, as says "redoubted" (with a 't') instead of redoubled. But seems great!

- An Invisible Ring: Including an exception won't spend much room. It's just that doesn't make much sense to use The One Ring against its own maker (besides, being invisible won't help). Might be Sauron only (not including " minions" or "Nazgûl"): "(except Sauron)". Or "(except Sauron and Nazgûl)".

- Dragon's Malice: Seems OK, it'll force to use Bilbo more often to face Smaug = per site, 3 doubts (+ some followers' aid cost), + 1 doubt also per each Orkish Aggressor he'll need to discard.

- Wrath of the Dragon: It's active skill seems better as a skirmish ability. But I wonder how will Smaug kill allies... that'll depend on the FP pack and the FP player, and can happen seldom. I'd keep that idea, but mixing it with the previous direct wound skill:

"Each time Smaug kills a character, you may wound a character (or add a doubt if the killed character was an ally)." Those are not 2 lines though, but 3.


Seems to be very few things to adjust before the final version gets released!

[-Enola-]

- An Invisible Ring: I change it for only Sauron (5 card lines!), but I removed the "(except card type and race)" from the Phial of Galadriel. The text remains correct?

- Wrath of the Dragon: I iput something new on this card (2 card lines, no more). When Smaug kills a character, the Shadow player can play an Orc from his discard pile (Yazneg or another one, but there is no fierce Orc)  to have some fuel to use the regroup ability of Smaug . It seems balanced.

[Durin's Heir]

- An Invisible Ring: Seems fine. There's a Wiki page for game text, which says the CRD states "Card titles, subtitles, and items on the card type line (card types, races, and classes) are not game text." So given that rule, the exception specified by Star-glass is totally redundant.

- Wrath of the Dragon: Neat idea! There are 2 fierce Orcs (The Great Goblin and the Wolves Army), but are expensive and specific to the 2 Swarm packs, and aren't too strong (str 10) so Thorin might deal with them (then it's safer to play non-fierce ones).

- His Wrath Was Redoubled: The title still says "redoubTed". Everything else is perfect. But this new version has 1 spare card line for lore text, so you may return the part "wolves and" which was trimmed to allow it to fit into 2 lines: "The roar of his voice was like drums... he tossed wolves and goblins from his path like straws and feathers."


I reviewed all new cards again, and again found no problems. But Dark Bats might have 1 more game text line: "This minion may not bear possessions." Like the tentacles . It doesn't change anything, but allows for more freedom to develop possessions, like Decipher's Goblin Spear. And would make this Dark Bats cannot be target of transferable fortifications .

[-Enola-]

Thank you very much, I changed His Wrath Was Redoubled.

Dark Bats: It doesn't seem necessary, moreover Stone Giants will need this sentence too. The possessions will be specific to Orcs or Trolls, it seems simpler.

Everything seems alright now .

[Durin's Heir]

Ok to make possessions specific to Trolls and/or Orcs only. HWWR looks very professional!

Magnificent! There's not a single loose end now . I don't know if you already changed the year (and the symbol on the 4 different Bilbos) to upload them later, and if you are going to change Fimbul's lore text, and the "collector's info" in the bottom right rectangle. Or if those unsubstantial details will be omitted. But besides that, everything seems fine. 

It's been truly a pleasure to help you in the process.

So I'll start my job as HDG lobbyist! This marvelous work of yours cannot be left outside Gemp.

[-Enola-]

Thank you a lot for your help. Without you, I would never have done so well  .

Yes, I change the bottom right and some images, tell me if everything seems perfect now (I didn't change Bilbo bottom right for (A), I prefer to keep it like this). We can recognize the different cards from each deck and packs, but you have to download the cards avalaible here to see it:

http://hobbitdraftgame.free.fr/Download.html

If you know someone who can use java, feel free. I don't think dmaz will do it .

[-Enola-]

I wanted to print the cards, and at the last moment I realise that a good modification on some Gandalf could be great. events are useless cards for most of the Gandalf at site 5 and sometimes after if Gandalf doesn't appear again soon.

The Grey and Leader of the Company are 2 great and balanced wizards: the first one brings several damages but is discarded at site 5 (except with White Council, Wizard or Mirkwood packs) and the other brings stability. Tell me what you think about these 2 new Gandalf:

http://hobbitdraftgame.free.fr/New_Updates/Gandalf.png

http://hobbitdraftgame.free.fr/New_Updates/Gandalf2.png

I want to promote To Me ! O My Kinsfolk ! (use of followers from discard pile) and Take up arms. Fight! (need stability of Gandalf to be used).
   
I will modify Jail then, do you have a proposition for a lore text for Jail?

[Durin's Heir]

Thank you a lot for your help. Without you, I would never have done so well  .

Yes, I change the bottom right and some images, tell me if everything seems perfect now (I didn't change Bilbo bottom right for (A), I prefer to keep it like this).

An Invisible Ring still says 2015. Everything else is alright. But I really believe you should change the symbol of the 4 Bilbos, and now 2 Gandalfs too, for (A). Because it denotes that a change was done to the functionality of the card, and an "(A)" version of a given card comes to replace the text/attributes of a "(1)" version of the same. That's important for those who printed the early versions. Just like 1R55 The Mirror of Galadriel, those players that held the 1st version could still play it, but with the text of the last corrected one.

Considering that, you can create a new "Erratum cards" or "Corrected cards" tab, showing what cards have changed in the course of the released Sets. It'd have now 6 cards: 4 Bilbos & 2 Gandalfs.

We can recognize the different cards from each deck and packs...

Alright.

If you know someone who can use java, feel free. I don't think dmaz will do it .

Dmaz doesn't log in since 2 months (May 23) . An email is the only way then...

I don't know anyone who can use jscript. And don't discard the idea of learning it myself, for this waiting may last too many months...

...

Tell me what you think about these 2 new Gandalf:

http://hobbitdraftgame.free.fr/New_Updates/Gandalf.png
http://hobbitdraftgame.free.fr/New_Updates/Gandalf2.png

You exchanged the subtitles, was it intentional? The new skills seem better. "Gandalf.png" (the new "Leader of Dwarves") can exert 4 times before site 5 (to play Dwarf companions), and then reappear fresh (but unarmed). "Gandalf2.png" (the new "Friend of Thorin") can be played now with Thorin + Dwalin/Balin/Nori, which adds new possibilities, and uses followers to remain through site 5. I like those changes!

I want to promote To Me ! O My Kinsfolk ! (use of followers from discard pile) and Take up arms. Fight! (need stability of Gandalf to be used).

There's a simple way to improve To Me! O My Kinsfolk!: make it a "Fellowship or Regroup" event. All follower-discarding is post-fellowship phase (except Thorin's skill), so being able to play this event at regroup helps to counter Yazneg or Smaug (as well as the cost of FP cards), while unclogging your hand and allowing that replayed follower to take part in a double move. That way, the event gets much more appeal and usefulness (without changing a single word in the text box!).

The new FP mechanics will get benefited a lot from this change.

I will modify Jail then, do you have a proposition for a lore text for Jail?

Gandalf speaks in Bag End about his meeting with Thráin in Dol Guldur (The Hobbit, Chapter 1):
- "...a prisoner in the dungeons of the Necromancer."
- "...a nasty dangerous business it was. Even I, Gandalf, only just escaped."

Besides, he mentions in Rivendell this about his imprisonment in Orthanc (the Fellowship of the Ring, Book II, Chapter 2):
- "I stood alone on an island in the clouds; and I had no chance of escape, and my days were bitter."
- "I was pierced with cold, and I had but little room in which to pace to and fro..."
- "I was in an evil plight. And those who know me will agree that I have seldom been in such need..."
- "...I have seldom been in such need, and do not bear such misfortune well."
- "Gandalf the Grey caught like a fly in a spider's treacherous web!"

All should fit into 2 lines (Gandalf won't have skirmish abilities , so those 2 lines are free now). For the purpose and context of Jail, I like a lot those in bold, but it's only a personal preference.

I use this page to get the quotes, it has Tolkien's books (and other authors) in htm format so it's easy to search and process text (some are in english, don't ask me about the others ):
http://ae-lib.org.ua/_lit_XX_post.htm#tolkien

[-Enola-]

The link on the html file was still on Pity and I change the name of the card. Btw, I remove the Main_deck2 and Boosters2 pages.

The 4 Bilbos and the 2 Gandalf have an alternate (A).

You exchanged the subtitles, was it intentional? The new skills seem better. "Gandalf.png" (the new "Leader of Dwarves") can exert 4 times before site 5 (to play Dwarf companions), and then reappear fresh (but unarmed). "Gandalf2.png" (the new "Friend of Thorin") can be played now with Thorin + Dwalin/Balin/Nori, which adds new possibilities, and uses followers to remain through site 5. I like those changes!

Yes, it is intentional. Since the old Leader of Dwarves allows to only play Thorin with Gloin/Fili/Kili, I thought it would be better with any Dwarf. So the best way seems to be the current Gandalf. Since he reduces the cost of Thorin, Friend of Thorin is more a name for him than the other Gandalf.

There's a simple way to improve To Me! O My Kinsfolk!: make it a "Fellowship or Regroup" event. All follower-discarding is post-fellowship phase (except Thorin's skill), so being able to play this event at regroup helps to counter Yazneg or Smaug (as well as the cost of FP cards), while unclogging your hand and allowing that replayed follower to take part in a double move. That way, the event gets much more appeal and usefulness (without changing a single word in the text box!).

To Me! O My Kinsfolk! is in all 8 decks and in all FP packs. I don't want to change that many cards. Gandalf or Bilbo are ok because I don't have a lot of copies of them. I prefer to keep the current To Me! O My Kinsfolk!. Moreover, the combo To Me! O My Kinsfolk!+Roac+Crown of Erebor is really good. We will make similar ideas for the Balin and Blue Mountains packs.

I changed Jail.

[Durin's Heir]

An Invisible Ring and the changed Gandalfs and Bilbos seems fine.

The subtitle change seems good too. And Jail looks much better with a lore text.

To Me! O My Kinsfolk! is in all 8 decks and in all FP packs. I don't want to change that many cards.

Changing To Me! O My Kinsfolk! for 8 players = changing 16 cards (8 in main decks, 8 in boosters). It's much more than the 12 cards you already changed (8x Bilbo + 4x Gandalf). The shortest modification (besides 0) is to change a non-event FP main deck card, that'd use only 1 card per player.

This should be the best way to allow To Me! O My Kinsfolk! to be played on regroup. By adding this passive text to Balin: " fellowship events may be played during the regroup phase", 2 lines. That's only 8 cards per 8 players, half than changing the specific event.

There are only 2 fellowship events: To Me! O My Kinsfolk! (main deck), and King Under the Mountain (Dain pack). Playing those at regroup isn't remotely OP, but will give much more use to both events and followers, and that means also giving more use to Balin's recycling skill (which is a thing you wanted). And a slightly better cycling.

Besides, Balin would have a skill that shows true leadership (which is a thing he lacks by now), a wise conciliator's leadership as he shows in the films. Players'd have more interest in playing Balin soon (and keeping him alive), as he'd be the only way to recover followers in the same turn as they were discarded by you or the Shadow player. That also makes the new FP mechanic of discarding followers less costly.


I'll be anwering your PM soon (there's a lot of implicancies to consider).

[-Enola-]

Changing To Me! O My Kinsfolk! for 8 players = changing 16 cards (8 in main decks, 8 in boosters). It's much more than the 12 cards you already changed (8x Bilbo + 4x Gandalf). The shortest modification (besides 0) is to change a non-event FP main deck card, that'd use only 1 card per player.

This should be the best way to allow To Me! O My Kinsfolk! to be played on regroup. By adding this passive text to Balin: " fellowship events may be played during the regroup phase", 2 lines. That's only 8 cards per 8 players, half than changing the specific event.

There are only 2 fellowship events: To Me! O My Kinsfolk! (main deck), and King Under the Mountain (Dain pack). Playing those at regroup isn't remotely OP, but will give much more use to both events and followers, and that means also giving more use to Balin's recycling skill (which is a thing you wanted). And a slightly better cycling.

The changes on the different Gandalf were done in order to counter the site 5 and have more stable fellowships. I took this opportunity to use followers (and so To Me! O My Kinsfolk!). To Me! O My Kinsfolk! has a wonderful sinergy in the Dain Pack with Roac and Crown of Erebor, I want to make it similar in the Balin and Blue Mountains Packs.

Unless there is a big problem on a card, changing 16 times the same card seems not necessary for me. I changed the Bilbos after the first part of the game was finished (due to the power of Gollum), I just did it in a similar way for the Gandalf.

Besides, Balin would have a skill that shows true leadership (which is a thing he lacks by now), a wise conciliator's leadership as he shows in the films. Players'd have more interest in playing Balin soon (and keeping him alive), as he'd be the only way to recover followers in the same turn as they were discarded by you or the Shadow player. That also makes the new FP mechanic of discarding followers less costly.

Balin will be improved in the Balin Pack and he is very powerful in the Wizard and White Council Packs with the Staff and Nenya.

I'll be anwering your PM soon (there's a lot of implicancies to consider).

Thanks a lot, I think this last update (I hope!) seems necesdary due to the duration of the game with the Swarm and Beatdown Packs 2.