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Total Votes : 12
Bilbo, Retired Adventurer
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 12:53 pm
Joined: 17 Feb 2006 Posts: 54 Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Isn’t it too late to make Southrons now due to the fact that most of them are rotating? Confused
The deck sounds very convincing and fun,especially because it’s very well planned and has multiple options.
Hazael
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:52 pm
Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 444 Location: Up North
I only play casual. We dont care if they are being rotated out.... we still play with them as long as they were not on the x-list before they got rotated.
Some of the best scenarios on EE...
Up All Night Productions
The First
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 6:38 pm
Joined: 07 Oct 2005 Posts: 195 Location: Anderlecht, Belgium
Why only 2 Desert Lords and only 3 Seasoned Leaders?

I disagree about Red Wrath. With this deck, you should be able to have enough twilight to play it. Because it needs you to exert your minion, the ideal is to put it on a minion with an exertion left and a seasoned leader on it.

I found that this type of deck needs red wrath. Try to exert every companion into Red Wrath range, play two minions with 2 vitality left and you have a dead companion. Exhausting everyone is a lot harder especially with those high vitality companions like Gil-Galad. If you play the wrath, you can kill 3 vitality companions who were unwounded. The strike can’t do this.

Minions with some vitality left doesn’t "only give you a cosy feeling". They can be used to play RW or they can’t be killed with 1 wound which is good most of the time.
Hazael
Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 4:34 pm
Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 444 Location: Up North
Quote:
Why only 2 Desert Lords and only 3 Seasoned Leaders?


I believe in keeping a shadow deck down to 32-36 cards.

Look at the cost of Desert Lord. I guess I am just used to playing against choke decks here in our group. Everybody here puts allot of thought into twilight costs when making a fellowship deck. I noticed that other people dont seem to care in the least bit how much twilight will be available to the shadow player(s).
In the first few sites, Desert Lord is not going to help much.

I suppose you could take out one Raider Halberd and replace it with one Seasoned Leader, but you need to have a Raider Halberd in hand if you want to use every bit of Shadow twilight and still be able to use Whirling Strike.

Quote:
I disagree about Red Wrath. With this deck, you should be able to have enough twilight to play it. Because it needs you to exert your minion, the ideal is to put it on a minion with an exertion left and a seasoned leader on it.

I found that this type of deck needs red wrath. Try to exert every companion into Red Wrath range, play two minions with 2 vitality left and you have a dead companion. Exhausting everyone is a lot harder especially with those high vitality companions like Gil-Galad. If you play the wrath, you can kill 3 vitality companions who were unwounded. The strike can’t do this.


Again, its about the cost. I usually do not have enough unless I sacrifice playing something on the Shadow phase.
Here is an example:
1. I could save a vitality and 5 twilight for RW to kill a companion with 2 vitality during the Skirmish phase.
2. I could use that vitality to add an exertion to that same companion and save only 3 twilight for WS to kill him.

Also...
I dont think you understand that I need every bit of vitality for exertion and that I cannot waste vitality for each minion, because the shadow player chooses who is assigned to skirmish the companion with 2 vitality left. I need to keep my options open so I can kill the companion no matter how much vitality the minion that is skirmishing him has.

Quote:
Minions with some vitality left doesn’t "only give you a cosy feeling". They can be used to play RW or they can’t be killed with 1 wound which is good most of the time.


When playing against "strategic wound" free peoples, I switch tactics alittle bit.
Some of the best scenarios on EE...
Up All Night Productions
The First
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 7:37 am
Joined: 07 Oct 2005 Posts: 195 Location: Anderlecht, Belgium
Quote:

I believe in keeping a shadow deck down to 32-36 cards.


Yup, me too. I only use 36 cards with swarm decks. I prefer 32-34 cards max.

Quote:

Look at the cost of Desert Lord. I guess I am just used to playing against choke decks here in our group. Everybody here puts allot of thought into twilight costs when making a fellowship deck. I noticed that other people dont seem to care in the least bit how much twilight will be available to the shadow player(s).


The fact is that the Desert Lord is worth it to pay 6 twilight to play him.

I can imagine that you won’t play many Lords against Solo Smeagol or against a bunch of Hobbits, but all other decks should give you enough twilight.

What would your typical/ideal hand look like and cost with this deck?

Quote:

In the first few sites, Desert Lord is not going to help much.


Wounding strategies don’t tend to do much during the first few sites. A Desert Lord + Seasoned Leader on the other hand might overwhelm someone early game. He would deal 4 damage the first time and maybe stop your opponent from double moving because a Desert Lord + Seasoned Leader + Mumak is deadly (and after 2 sites equal to 6 wounds which can’t all be healed at a sanctuary).

So, yes, I disagree. But it isn’t easy to play such a combo early game. But I would use 4 Desert Lords and 4 Seasoned Leaders. The fun thing is that a Seasoned Leader can get another Seasoned Leader back (that can be played on any minion = another vitality to use Red Wrath with + minion becomes Enduring. Such a combo can kill companions that doesn’t look threathened at first sight).

Quote:

I suppose you could take out one Raider Halberd and replace it with one Seasoned Leader, but you need to have a Raider Halberd in hand if you want to use every bit of Shadow twilight and still be able to use Whirling Strike.


IMO this sounds terribly unefficient. You need a minion + Raider Halberd + Whirling Strike in your hand (= 3 cards and probably half your shadow hand) to deal 1 damage because a 8-10 strength minion won’t do much more than that. On top, that minion needs some extra vitality for the Halberd to create twilight which means no exertions during archery phase.

I think that I prefer my Desert Lord and Seasoned Leader combo. Notice that the second seasoned leader isn’t in your hand. It is actually hand extension (reuse of an allready played card, preferably at sites 1-3 so you can start taking it back from 4+).

Quote:

Again, its about the cost. I usually do not have enough unless I sacrifice playing something on the Shadow phase.
Here is an example:
1. I could save a vitality and 5 twilight for RW to kill a companion with 2 vitality during the Skirmish phase.


Yes, but that would also cost 3 twilight and some serious strength boost. The seasoned Leader + Red Wrath costs 6 twilight while your card only costs 3. But my combo can kill a 3 vitality character.
Quote:

2. I could use that vitality to add an exertion to that same companion and save only 3 twilight for WS to kill him.


Yes, that’s true. But how do you know where to put that 1 exertion? I prefer to put all companions within RW range and then kill someone with it. That’s a lot easier than exhausting everyone.
Quote:

Also...
I dont think you understand that I need every bit of vitality for exertion and that I cannot waste vitality for each minion, because the shadow player chooses who is assigned to skirmish the companion with 2 vitality left. I need to keep my options open so I can kill the companion no matter how much vitality the minion that is skirmishing him has.


I think that you focus too much on doing damage during archery. Like I said: it is a lot more efficient to put them all within RW range (less archery needed) and finish someone during skirmish. With the Seasoned Leaders getting other seasoned leaders back, you can actually exert as much as you want during archery phase. The 1 extra vitality from the Seasoned Leader that you get back and play on any minion you like, can actually kill the companion that you hate the most. But so can Whirling Strike I guess.
Anonymous Prodigy
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 5:14 pm
Joined: 10 Jan 2006 Posts: 4197 Location: United States
Great article, Hazael. Good job on going in depth with the cards and decklists. I give this a 4.
I had to put something here.
Cobra
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 6:29 pm
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 1202 Location: Austin, TX, USA
Congrats to Hazael -- this article ties for 2nd place in the February 2006 LOTR TCG Strategy Article Contest.
http://cobracards.com -- Web's best deals on Trading Card Games.
Hazael
Posted: Thu Mar 02, 2006 3:44 pm
Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 444 Location: Up North
Cool! thx cobra


The First:
I am thinking about putting another Desert Lord and another Seasoned Leader in.

I just need to think about my minion to event/possesion ratio in my typical hand.

Currently, with my personal deck, I have a 1v2 ratio of minions to a 1v2 ratio of events/possesions. It seems to work perfectly. I dont really want to make my deck any bigger because my fellowship is rangers. I need to get Ancient Roads out.

I dont know exactly what I am going to sacrifice in my personal deck yet. (I only have 3 raider halberds 3 whirling strikes 3 seasoned leaders and 3 mumaks) I will for sure take out my Haradrim Marksmen and put it another Desert Lord... I just need to trade for one.

As for twilight... tOO and phazanzar have decks that allow for almost no twilight. Sad phazanzar uses his solo smeagel mostly and tOO uses his Dwarven choke. phazanzar goes to site 3 with a total of 3 twilight to work with. tOO chokes big time with three dwarves that are like strength 16 each and damage +infinity. Now you might understand why I had to go into a "strategic wound" strategy in order to win.

on the other hand, Bigboy and Lilboy allow for enough twilight for me to play
anything.
my decks are right in the middle... I used to have VERY expensive fpeeps, but now i really cut down on the costs.
(my ranger deck used to give an average of no less than 15 twilight on the first site!)
Some of the best scenarios on EE...
Up All Night Productions

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