The Last Homely House
Middle-Earth => Chamber of Mazarbul => Topic started by: eomund on September 28, 2009, 05:07:09 AM
-
I'm not quite committed to trying to make a full set (yet ... it seems like a cool idea), I thought I'd share a couple of random ideas I've had over the years.
This first one was spawned because of how little support (at least that I've seen) in the game for recovering from losses. Yes there's healing, and a couple armour-type cards, but nothing along the lines of:
[3] •Dain Ironfoot, Slayer of Azog [dwarven]
Companion • Dwarf
St: 7
Vi: 3
Re: 6
Damage +1.
While you can spot a Dwarf, Dain Ironfoot is twilight cost -1.
Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving an Orc, Dain Ironfoot is strength +2 and damage +1 until the regroup phase.
It may be a little narrow (since the skirmish has to be lost to an orc), but it's more flavourful that way (Dain kills Azog after he kills another Dwarf ... I think it was Thain, but I'd have to check to be sure). Which leads me into my second card, a more flavourful interpretation of someone ruthlessly cut from the movie:
[2] •Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 6
Vi: 3
Re: 8
Ranger.
Response: If the ring-bearer puts on the One Ring, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
Again, a little narrow, but I think it has build-around-me potential. If you can get your ring-bearer to comfortably survive fights, you could really get moving along the site path.
I had been hoping to post more, but I've been informed I have to leave sooner than expected. All reviews are welcome, and I'll probably add to this list sometime tomorrow.
-
[3] •Dain Ironfoot, Slayer of Azog [dwarven]
Companion • Dwarf
St: 7
Vi: 3
Re: 6
Damage +1.
While you can spot a Dwarf, Dain Ironfoot is twilight cost -1.
Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving an Orc, Dain Ironfoot is strength +2 and damage +1 until the regroup phase.
I don't really think that I like the flavor of this card too much. I think I would rather just have Dain have a strength bonus against Orcs. Like:
While skirmishing an [Orc] minion, Dain is strength +2 (or strength +2 and damage +1 if skirmishing a unique [Orc] minion).
Would you use this guy over Dain Ironfoot, King Under the Mountain? I don't know that I would, but that's just me.
[2] •Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 6
Vi: 3
Re: 8
Ranger.
Response: If the ring-bearer puts on the One Ring, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
You should keep the main statistics the same: [4], strength 9, vitality 3, resistance 7. I guess I get the idea of the text, but putting on the One Ring is awfully easy with the maneuver phase rings (The One Ring, Such a Weight to Carry and even worse, The One Ring, The Great Ring) that you could make the move limit greater without the Ring-Bearer having to be assigned to a skirmish. Or, with a copy of The Tale of Gil-Galad and O Elbereth! Githoniel! you could make the move limit +2 and that just doesn't seem right either.
I'd like to see Dain and Thranduil's thoughts on these cards, because they would be much better of helping you come up with gametext that would be similar to what you are trying to do with these cards.
-wtk
-
[3] •Dain Ironfoot, Slayer of Azog [dwarven]
Companion • Dwarf
St: 7
Vi: 3
Re: 6
Damage +1.
While you can spot a Dwarf, Dain Ironfoot is twilight cost -1.
Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving an Orc, Dain Ironfoot is strength +2 and damage +1 until the regroup phase.
Narrow, yes, but I think good. I'm all about flavor as long as it doesn't make cards absolutely unusable, and this is far from that. His ability is nifty, but even if he never gets to use it, you're still looking at a [2]-cost 7/3/damage +1 companion, and that alone makes him worth tossing in to a good Dwarf deck. I think it would be better to say "Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving an Orc, make Dain Ironfoot strength +2 and damage +1 until the regroup phase." Other than that, cool beans! :up:
[2] •Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 6
Vi: 3
Re: 8
Ranger.
Response: If the ring-bearer puts on the One Ring, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
Just FYI: keep in mind that two versions of Glorfindel already exist in the game--Revealed In Wrath and Eldarin Lord--and they both have quite different stats. But since this guy lacks the fighting prowess (at least in terms of game text) of those other versions, I think you can safely match his stats with the others and use a starting-fellowship cost reduction like that on Revealed In Wrath. So something like this:
[4]•Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 9
Vi: 3
Re: 7
Ranger.
While Glorfindel is in your starting fellowship, his twilight cost is -1 (or -2 if you can spot an Elf).
Response: If the Ring-bearer puts on the One Ring, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
After reading what ket posted, he's probably right. I suggest this:
Response: If the Ring-bearer puts on the One Ring during a skirmish, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
-
Thanks for the suggestions :gp:. I'm going to keep my Dain as is for now, but change Glorfindel to:
[4] •Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [Elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 9
Vi: 3
Re: 7
Ranger.
Glorfindel's twilight cost is -1 for every two burdens you can spot.
Response: If the Ring-bearer puts on the One Ring during a skirmish, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
It's too bad his ability no longer works with all rings, but since he's a companion you get to choose which ring, so I don't view that as a major loss. I'm hesitant to put a limit on the move bonus, as I think it takes enough work now to make the move limit +2 (as I've shown, though, I'm no expert on the cards available, so let me know if this isn't the case). On that note, while I knew Decipher had made at least one Glorfindel, I neglected to actually look at them. :-[
I like his twilight cost reduction keying off burdens, as it also ties in with the idea that this is Glorfindel saving Frodo from corruption. Plus, I don't know of any other starting companions caring about the burdens you bid, even though the rules of the game allow it. As with the move limit, I don't think a limit is necessary here (carrying 6 or 8 burdens at the start of the game is pretty severe), but I'd definitely want one if something degenerate could occur.
Okay, now on to some new stuff. These two are intended to be part of a cycle (1 companion for each free peoples culture), but are the only two I've made so far. They're intended to alleviate the frustration of drawing a possession or event for a character who's still in your draw deck.
[5] •Eomer, Firefoot's Rider [rohan]
Companion • Man
St: 8
Vi: 3
Re: 7
Damage +1. Defender +1. Valiant.
Eomer counts as being mounted. Firefoot may not be played.
Add 1 to the number of [rohan] mounts you can spot.
At the beginning of each skirmish involving Eomer, each minion he is skirmishing must exert.
[6] •Aragorn, Wielder of the Sword Reforged [gondor]
Companion • Man
St: 10
Vi: 5
Re: 8
Damage +1. Defender +1.
Aragorn counts as bearing a hand weapon. Anduril may not be played.
Add 1 to the number of [gondor] artifacts you can spot.
Hopefully all the rules work out appropriately. I'm really unsure about the costs for these guys ... how much does a possession that you don't need to draw cost in twilight? Eomer is strength +1 from his base stats because there's no way there's enough room for his usual "twilight cost -1" ability. And the newest Firefoot gives him a strength bonus (yes, I did my research this time). As is, I'm still not sure his text fits onto a card.
I chose a cost of 6 for Aragorn since Anduril isn't giving him an ability, and to be cost 7 I'd feel obligated to give him a twilight reduction ability, which would push his text box to the limit as well. I really wanted him to be "Wielder of the Sword That Was Broken," but again, I doubt that would fit on a card. I do realize these aren't going to actually be cards, but I want to be realistic whenever I can.
Comments and reviews are of course still welcome!
-
[5] •Eomer, Firefoot's Rider [rohan]
Companion • Man
St: 8
Vi: 3
Re: 7
Damage +1. Defender +1. Valiant.
Eomer counts as being mounted. Firefoot may not be played.
Add 1 to the number of [rohan] mounts you can spot.
At the beginning of each skirmish involving Eomer, each minion he is skirmishing must exert.
The Dwarf and Elf were alright, but this guy is ridiculous! I don't really like it when companions veer from their basic stats (in this case, [3], strength 7 (with a built in strength bonus) or 8, and vitality 3. Why would I want to use this guy? I would way rather use Third Marshal of Riddermark, Eomer's Spear, and Firefoot for defender +1, damage +2 and strength 11 against most minions. I don't mind the "Add one to the number of mounts you can spot" part, but I just don't think I would ever want to use this guy.
Also, the subtitle is pretty lame. I don't think of Eomer as Firefoot's Rider, I think of Firefoot as Eomer's Mount. I understand the digging through your draw deck for possessions, but that is what Simbelmyne and Eomer, Keeper of Oaths, etc., are for and not having a possession some times is part of the game.
[3] •Eomer, First of the Fourth Age [Rohan]
Companion • Man
Strength 8
Vitality 3
Resistance 7
Valiant.
While Eomer is mounted, the twilight cost of each [Rohan] man is -1.
Skirmish: Exert Eomer to discard a possession borne by a minion he is skirmishing. The shadow player may liberate a site to prevent this.
That way, each [Rohan] man is cheaper to play as Eomer musters the Rohirrim. It still plays off the idea of his horse, but isn't so...revolutionary.
[6] •Aragorn, Wielder of the Sword Reforged [gondor]
Companion • Man
St: 10
Vi: 5
Re: 8
Damage +1. Defender +1.
Aragorn counts as bearing a hand weapon. Anduril may not be played.
Add 1 to the number of [gondor] artifacts you can spot.
I have to go on a similar note here. I don't mind Aragorn as strength 9, vitality 4, and costing [5] like Aragorn, Elessar Telcontar, but with damage and defender bonuses, these guys are ridiculous. What is the help of him "counting as bearing a hand weapon?" I just have to say...I'm really not a fan of the idea of the characters with built in weapons.
[5] •Aragorn, King [Gondor]
Companion • Man
Strength 9
Vitality 4
Resistance 8
While Aragorn bears Anduril, each Man is resistance +1.
While you can spot 2 [Gondor] artifacts, each companion is strength +1.
That would be about as close to a similar idea as what I could draw from your card. He plays directly off of having Anduril, but it is not built in. And each companion grows stronger when Aragorn assumes the throne.
-wtk
-
i like your post ket, but the idea of have possessions built into the cards goes back to star wars. it meant one less card in your deck, while having the bonus of the possession you need. when i started back in FOTR block, i was already well into Star Wars and was always thinking how sweet it would be to have built in possessions.
-
i like your post ket, but the idea of have possessions built into the cards goes back to star wars. it meant one less card in your deck, while having the bonus of the possession you need. when i started back in FOTR block, i was already well into Star Wars and was always thinking how sweet it would be to have built in possessions.
I guess that just makes LotR lose a lot of its flavor. Can you imagine Frodo with a built-in One Ring? Are we throwing Frodo into the fire?
-wtk
-
I guess that just makes LotR lose a lot of its flavor. Can you imagine Frodo with a built-in One Ring? Are we throwing Frodo into the fire?
-wtk
I view it along the lines of Dain's double companions ... the card is representing two things at once. In this case, Eomer and Firefoot or Aragorn and Anduril.
Aragorn counts as "bearing a hand weapon" so that you can't slap Ranger's Sword on Aragorn to make him even bigger. He's already bearing Anduril, so he can't bear another weapon. That was the easiest and clearest way I could think of to portray that.
Thinking of it that way also makes their stats make a lot more sense (and is how I came up with the stats in the first place). Aragorn is strength 8+2 and vitality 4+1, while Eomer is strength 7+1. Aragorn is defender +1 for being Aragorn, and damage +1 for Anduril. Eomer is damage +1 for being Eomer and defender +1 for Firefoot.
While I would also use Third Marshall with Firefoot if I were starting Eomer, the idea of these guys is to alleviate deck building challenges. If I had 4 slots left to fill and decided some choice of Eomer would be a good fit, I'd rather have 4 of this guy (or some variant of him ... I won't deny he needs tweaking) than splitting those extra slots between Eomer and Firefoot.
-
I don't know. I don't play Star Wars CCG so I suppose I don't see the fun in that. Despite the fact that Aragorn would generally be [4] and Anduril would generally be [3], because the two are put together into one card the cost would likely be [8] or even [9], especially considering the defender and damage bonuses.
Combining two cards into one card wouldn't be cheaper, you would have to pay more twilight for the convenience.
Again, I think that takes away from a lot of the flavor of the game. Minions discarding possessions is a part of the game that you are taking away. I mean, I can't think of a "discard an artifact" card off of the top of my head, but you get the idea.
For what it's worth, here would be syntax-correct models of your cards:
[7] •Aragorn, Wielder of the Anduril [Gondor]
Companion • Man
Strength 10, Vitality 5, Resistance 8
Damage +1. Defender +1.
Aragorn may not bear hand weapons. Add 1 to the number of artifacts you can spot.
Again, the [7] twilight would be minimum.
[5] •Eomer, Firefoot's Rider [Rohan]
Companion • Man
Strength 8, Vitality 3, Resistance 7
Valiant. Damage +1. Defender +1.
Eomer may not bear a mount. Firefoot may not be played. Add 1 to the number of mounts you can spot.
At the start of each skirmish involving Eomer, each minion skirmishing Eomer must exert.
This guy would cost more that [5] because you have combined the best parts of each Firefoot (not all of them made him defender +1.
I guess I am just someone who doesn't like these "do everything" companions or cards in general. I prefer the idea of having to build my deck knowing that the game is about match-ups and gives and takes. When you look at the big-#$&*@! Ents, they are strong and most don't even have game text or damage bonuses or very specific scenarios for defender bonuses...I don't know. I mean, I hate to sound like I am shitting on your idea but these cards just seem too...out of place for Lord of the Rings.
-wtk
-
I don't play Star Wars either ... I just thought it was cool idea worth exploring. And you're right about the cost ... I was comparing too closely to Magic, where a cost 7 card is far less playable than a cost 4 card. Not the case in LotR. With that in mind, here are some updated versions (complete with ket's new, improved wording):
[7] •Aragorn, Wielder of the Blade Reforged [gondor]
Companion • Man
Strength 10, Vitality 5, Resistance 8
Damage +1.
Aragorn may not bear hand weapons. Anduril may not be played. Add 1 to the number of [gondor] artifacts you can spot.
[5] •Eomer, Firefoot's Rider [rohan]
Companion • Man
Strength 8, Vitality 3, Resistance 7
Valiant.
Eomer may not bear a mount. Firefoot may not be played. Add 1 to the number of [rohan] mounts you can spot.
At the start of each skirmish involving Eomer, each minion skirmishing Eomer must exert.
This also has the advantage of slightly reducing the do-everything quality of the original cards. I added the "Anduril may not be played" to Aragorn partly to hammer home the idea that Aragorn comes with Anduril, and partly in case an Anduril ever came out which could be borne by another character ... somehow ...
I appreciate your comments, ket ... it's very interesting to hear the opinion of someone who disagrees with me. I obviously agree with myself, so if I wanted to think my idea was flawless, I wouldn't have posted it.
-
Why do you have "Andruil may not be played?" As Anduril is only bearable by Aragorn and it is a hand weapon, you only need the first sentence...I don't think you need to worry about an Anduril that anyone else can bear. Unless you made it...then there would be some problems! [Insert a smiley face here to know that I am being playful and not offensive].
The reason the Firefoot line is included on the Eomer is that Firefoot can be played on any [Rohan] man, so that does need to be specified. I would still try to come up with better subtitles. The Aragorn one is closer than Eomer's.
These versions do look a little more balanced in the sense that you aren't drawing the best parts out of each version of the cards and lopping them together. Although Eomer is definitely missing a bite...I don't see why anyone would use him as opposed to an Eomer (with gametext) with a mount. That one can probably stand to at least still have the defender bonus I think because you are right about not being able to fit much more game text onto a card!
Anyways, I will be interested to see what you come up with in the [Gandalf] and [Shire] races. A hobbit Archer, perhaps?
-wtk
-
What if rather than combining a companion and a possession, you combined two possessions? It could look like Elven Armaments (although maybe it is not a good sign if it look like a Hunters block card) but an example could be:
[3] •Bilbo's Gifts [Shire]
Artifact • Hand Weapon/Armor
Strength +2, Resistance +2
Bearer must be a Ring-Bound hobbit.
Sting may not be played. Mithril Coat may not be played.
Each minion skirmishing bearer loses strength bonuses from weapons and loses all damage bonuses.
That's a poor example off of the top of my head, but then you don't have to run multiple copies of Sting and Mithril Coat, etc.
-wtk
-
An Anduril someone other than Aragorn can bear, and DCs inspired by Hunters block ... what is the world coming to? Next thing you know there'll be a Gollum who gets a strength bonus every time an elven event is played :P :lol:
[3] •Bilbo's Gifts [Shire]
Artifact • Hand Weapon/Armor
Strength +2, Resistance +2
Bearer must be a Ring-Bound hobbit.
Sting may not be played. Mithril Coat may not be played.
Each minion skirmishing bearer loses strength bonuses from weapons and loses all damage bonuses.
Interesting idea, ket ... it's funny, my gut reaction was "you can't do that ... it makes deckbuilding too easy!" So in a weird way I think I understand now some of your concerns about the companions. I'm not sure I like either at this point. Double possessions would be harder to abuse, since part of being on the same card means any possession discarding would take out both at once. On the flip side, you could search for both with a single symblemine or similar. But that was the case for the companions, too.
This is making my head hurt a little bit. I think I'll leave that cycle alone for now (although comments on them, as well as Glorfindel and Dain Ironfoot are always welcome).
The two hobbits I aluded to earlier are Virtual Cards (see Thranduil's explanation of the concept here http://lotrtcgdb.com/forums/index.php/topic,1207.0.html).
The first one I wanted to make because his original Decipher card ... well, it sucks.
[1] •Fredegar Bolger, Fatty (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 3, Res 7
While at a the fellowship is at a dwelling, Fredegar Bolger cannot be overwhelmed unless his strength is tripled.
Skirmish: Discard Fredegar Bolger to cancel a skirmish involving another hobbit. Any shadow player may remove a threat to prevent this.
I originally had him exert twice for his second ability, but I don't think it should be that easy to repeat an annoying ability like unrestricted skirmish cancelling.
The second hobbit is actually a pretty good companion, but I felt the flavour was off.
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples culture you can spot, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
In the book, Sam is feared by the orcs not because he actually is strong, but because of all of the cultural goodies they found on Frodo (Sam's barrow sword, Frodo's Mithril coat, and his Elven cloak). Unfortunately, since Sting and Mithril Coat are [shire] cards, it can't easily spot off the culture of possessions on Frodo. Another potential incarnation is:
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples artifact or possession borne by the ring-bearer, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
I personally prefer the first one, as I have a soft spot in my heart for Nine Walkers decks, and it would play quite nicely in such a deck. Thoughts?
-
Fredegar Bolger would be better with just this text:
Skirmish: If Fredegar Bolger is not assigned to a skirmish, discard him to cancel a skirmish involving a hobbit. Any shadow player may remove a threat to prevent this.
Sam, Great Elf Warrior would not be resistance 10 if it was a virtual card.
For the record (and of course, if I remember correctly), Sam never wore the Mithril Coat. Personally, I like the flavor of the second one based on the idea of him as the Great Elf Warrior in Cirith Ungol.
-wtk
-
I didn't mean that Sam wore the Mithril Coat; I meant that because Frodo had his, the orcs assumed Sam also had one. The idea of that card was that the more cultures around Sam there were, the stronger minions assume he is.
And Virtual cards can have different stats than the originals (just look at Thranduil's version of Legolas) ... it's only the name, cost, picture and culture that need to match. I felt Sam deserved the higher resistance because when Frodo is in Cirith Ungol is when Sam really shines.
Now that I think of it, that's the period of time when he's carrying the ring himself, so maybe GEW should be an alternate ring-bearer ... or maybe not. Btw, is there a ring-bearer version of Sam (not counting the "if Frodo is killed" versions).
-
Yes and he is resistance 5.
I forgot his name though. Sam, Bearer of Great Need, maybe?
-wtk
-
... it's only the name, cost, picture and culture that need to match.
Definitely find a clearer picture than the Sam, Great Elf Warrior picture! I originally thought that you intended on making him an ARB, which would be an interesting idea.
I just thought that Sam as an aid would be sweet (not a virtual card):
[2] •Sam, Hobbit of Tales and Legends
Aid • Hobbit
Strength +2, Resistance +2
Bearer must be the Ring-Bearer.
Aid- Remove X burdens and add X threats.
If Bearer is Frodo, discard Sam to wound a minion he is skirmishing (or wound that minion twice if it is a [Gollum] minion.
Okay, he'd probably cost way more than [2]!
-wtk
-
No aid at all?
-
No aid at all?
I don't know what you mean by that? I suppose I had the cost of playing him as removing the same amount of burdens and threats. I guess that doesn't work anyways.
-wtk
-
You could remove 0 burdens to add 0 threats.
-
[3] •Dain Ironfoot, Slayer of Azog [dwarven]
Companion • Dwarf
St: 7
Vi: 3
Re: 6
Damage +1.
While you can spot a Dwarf, Dain Ironfoot is twilight cost -1.
Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving an Orc, Dain Ironfoot is strength +2 and damage +1 until the regroup phase.
Hilarious! I would be tempted to lose the initial damage bonus in favour of making it work for any minion - yes it's more flavourful, but unfortunately a bit too narrow to be used. Or, you could do a compromise, something like "Each time a Dwarf loses a skirmish involving a minion, Dáin Ironfoot is strength +2 (and damage +1 if that minion is an Orc) until the regroup phase.
[2] •Glorfindel, Elrond's Messenger [elven]
Companion • Elf
St: 6
Vi: 3
Re: 8
Ranger.
Response: If the ring-bearer puts on the One Ring, exert Glorfindel twice to make the move limit +1 this turn.
Interesting... I feel like 2/6/3 is too small for one of the greatest Elf lords of the Third Age - he sits much more comfortably at his usual 4/9/3, and you could then have a cost reduction, like "While the Ring-bearer has resistance 8 or more, Glorfindel's twilight cost is -2". Nice card otherwise.
[7] •Aragorn, Wielder of the Blade Reforged [gondor]
Companion • Man
Strength 10, Vitality 5, Resistance 8
Damage +1.
Aragorn may not bear hand weapons. Anduril may not be played. Add 1 to the number of [gondor] artifacts you can spot.
[5] •Eomer, Firefoot's Rider [rohan]
Companion • Man
Strength 8, Vitality 3, Resistance 7
Valiant.
Eomer may not bear a mount. Firefoot may not be played. Add 1 to the number of [rohan] mounts you can spot.
At the start of each skirmish involving Eomer, each minion skirmishing Eomer must exert.
I think a better way to go about these would be something like this:
[5] •Éomer and •Firefoot [Rohan]
Companion • Man • Mount
Str: 8
Vit: 3
Res: 7
Defender +1. Valiant.
At the start of each skirmish involving Éomer, each minion he is skirmishing must exert.
So you see I've solved several problems here: 1) now Éomer and Firefoot are mentioned explicitly in the title (it probably should have a subtitle as well) meaning that you cannot play either card again, because a version of each is in play. 2) I've lost some text by putting "Mount" in his type line. This would mean that he can't bear another mount and counts as a mounted companion, again saving you a lot of text. You could do Aragorn similarly:
[7] •Aragorn and •Andúril [Gondor]
Companion • Man • Hand Weapon
Just a thought to make your life easier! Star Wars did something similar - it had a built-in weapon icon.
[1] •Fredegar Bolger, Fatty (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 3, Res 7
While at a the fellowship is at a dwelling, Fredegar Bolger cannot be overwhelmed unless his strength is tripled.
Skirmish: Discard Fredegar Bolger to cancel a skirmish involving another hobbit. Any shadow player may remove a threat to prevent this.
Excellent flavour, but he's very powerful - he cancels 2 skirmishes, and if you're playing expanded you can combo him with the Towers unbound Hobbit discard like Knocked on the Head, Treebeard, Earthborn and Gandalf, Greyhame. I think a good fix would be "If Fredegar Bolger is not assigned to a skirmish, discard him to..." Then I think the combo potential is good, but no longer too good.
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples culture you can spot, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples artifact or possession borne by the ring-bearer, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
I do also like the first one best, but both are fun. I also hate limits, and in each case there's no real reason why the limit is necessary and so I would remove it - the original GEW doesn't have a limit, and he's just as good as these guys.
Thranduil
-
I also hate limits
I hate Pippin, Steadfast Friend.
But, Thranduil is right. When it comes to the first one, how many free peoples' cultures are there? [Dwarf], [Elf], [Gondor], [Gandalf], [Rohan], [Shire] which you already have out with Sam. So by playing more than four, the free peoples player is becoming susceptible to Ulaire Enquea, Lt. of Morgul, Greed, and similar cards. Just saying...
-wtk
-
You could remove 0 burdens to add 0 threats.
Haha...I thought of that after you brought up your first point. I'll be honest, I don't know anything about how an aid works, I was just goofing off and thought a Sam aid who shows up just at the nick of time in the Shelob's Lair was a cool idea.
-wtk
-
[1] •Fredegar Bolger, Fatty (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 3, Res 7
While at a the fellowship is at a dwelling, Fredegar Bolger cannot be overwhelmed unless his strength is tripled.
Skirmish: Discard Fredegar Bolger to cancel a skirmish involving another hobbit. Any shadow player may remove a threat to prevent this.
I like Thran's suggestion about limiting the skirmish ability to when Fatty is not already in a skirmish. Also, watch out: you have an extra "at a" in the first line of text. Oh, and always capitalize race names (so "Hobbit", in this case).
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples culture you can spot, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
[2] •Sam, Great Elf Warrior (V) [shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 10
Ring-bound.
For each free peoples artifact or possession borne by the ring-bearer, minions skirmishing Sam are strength -1 (limit -4).
Both are good, but I too like the first one better. I think you can remove the limit IF you change it to "For each Free Peoples culture you can spot in the fellowship...", similar wording as found on the ultimate Nine Walkers companion, Friend of the Shirefolk. Or just go with "For each race you can spot in the fellowship...". Culture is probably better, though, to get the max use out of cultures like [Gondor] and [Rohan]. :up:
-
Thranduil, I like your second suggestion for Dain Ironfoot. And I decided later in the thread to juice Glorfindel up to his usual stats, I just didn't take the time to edit the original post. Maybe I will sometime ...
I didn't even think of the double skirmish prevention on Fredegar ... I had to look at the card a couple of times to see it #-o ... It shall be changed.
Dain, I'm confused as to why Sam needs to say "in the fellowship" ... I think possessions and conditions should help him out just as much as companions of other cultures. And his limit shall be removed .... I forgot to consider the hoops the FP player would have to go through to actually get more than five cultures out.
-
It's taken me a bit of time, but I've fleshed out this idea enough to make it worth posting (I think). I'm sure a bunch of people have tried out things like this, but here is my interpretation of multiculture cards. As in cards that are two cultures at once. I've only come up with companions so far, but there's a bunch, so I don't feel I'm skimping out on this post at all.
Just to be clear, the rules for these guys are simply that they count as a companion of each of their cultures. For example, the first Aragorn is an [elven] Man, an [elven] Companion, a [gondor] Man, and a [gondor] Companion. And for what it's worth, I imagine the background of the card to be split down the middle (line drawn top to bottom), with one culture's colours on one side and the other culture's on the right. Like hybrid cards in Magic, for anyone who knows what they look like.
[4] •Aragorn, Estel [elven][gondor]
Companion • Man
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 8
Each time an Elf wins a skirmish, make Aragorn strength +1 until the regroup phase.
Estel, meaning hope, is the name given to Aragorn by Elrond when he was accepted into Elrond's household. He's a little smaller than usual partly because of his strength boost, and partly because this is a younger Aragorn.
[4] •Aragorn, Thorongil [gondor][rohan]
Companion • Man
Str 8, Vit 3, Res 8
While you can spot another [gondor] Man, Aragorn is defender +1.
While you can spot another [rohan] Man, Aragorn is damage +1.
Again, I felt a younger Aragorn shouldn't be quite as beefy as the in-his-prime (considering he lived to 200 (?), 85 seems to be in his prime) version of the books. And I can't think up a better name for him, so let me know if you can.
[3] •Eomer, Renewer of Oaths [gondor][rohan]
Companion • Man
Str 7, Vit 3, Res 6
While you can spot a [gondor] Man, Eomer's twilight cost is -1.
Skirmish: Exert Eomer and a [gondor] Man to make a [rohan] Man strength +3, or exert Eomer and a [rohan] Man to make a [gondor] Man strength +3.
If I understand the rules correctly, the way this is worded allows Eomer to exert twice to pump a companion, and allows Eomer to pump himself. The oath referred to is Eorl's oath to the stewards, which Eomer renewed to the newly crowned King.
[4] •Gandalf, Master of Fireworks [gandalf][shire]
Companion • Wizard
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Fellowship: Exert Gandalf and add [1] to play a tale from your draw deck.
I'm not really sure how powerful his ability is ... maybe it should cost nothing or [2]?
[4] •Gandalf, Steward of Men [gandalf][gondor]
Companion • Wizard
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Response: If a Man would exert, exert Gandalf to place no wound for that exertion.
Same comment as above.
[4] •Gandalf, Stormcrow [gandalf][rohan]
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Fellowship: Exert Gandalf twice to discard a Shadow condition (and if that condition was borne by a companion, heal that companion).
And again. Also, I think this name is okay since Stormcrow has been used on two cards (according to the database), neither of which look tournament legal. But other names are welcome anyway.
[2] •Gimli, Elf-Friend [dwarven][elven]
Companion • Dwarf
Str 6, Vit 3, Res 6
Damage +1.
Skirmish: Exert Gimli to make an Elf strength +1 (or +2 if that Elf is Legolas).
I think Gimli and Legolas (see if you can guess his game text without looking :P) are the simplest two of the multiculture companions ... they work best in a deck of the opposite race, and are able to spotted by (some) cards of both cultures.
[2] •Legolas, Friend of Dwarves [dwarven][elven]
Companion • Elf
Str 6, Vit 3, Res 6
Archer.
Skirmish: Exert Legolas to make a Dwarf strength +1 (or +2 if that Dwarf is Gimli).
Were you right?
[1] •Smeagol, Stoor of Gladden Fields [gollum][shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 5
Stealth events and conditions are twilight cost -1.
Finally, we have this guy. Notice that he's also been given a race ... too many shire cards spot Hobbits to make him effective otherwise. And if an Elendil card can be made, a Smeagol card set a far shorter time in the past can also be made.
Let me know what you think. I'm going to try to come up with a few non-companion cards, and possibly some shadow cards. If any of you have your own takes on this type of cards, I think it could be interesting to compare, so feel free to post them too.
-
To me, this is a cool and original idea; however, I don't know how great it is in application. Just a few thoughts off of the top of my head:
Gimli, Elf-Friend and Legolas, Friend of Dwarves have nearly the same game-text of Gimli, Unbidden Guest and Legolas, Elven Comrade. I know you can do better than that!
As for Smeagol, Stoor of Gladden Fields (great subtitle, by the way), he should still have the stipulation, "To play, add a burden." I don't think he should be a hobbit because of the work that Decipher did setting up the game to prevent him from being a universally used companion...just my opinion.
Gandalf, Stormcrow is incredibly powerful. I would be more inclined if it was just discarding conditions borne by companions instead of any condition. Or:
Fellowship: Exert Gandalf twice to discard a condition (or exert Gandalf once to discard a condition borne by a Free Peoples character).
Gandalf, Master of Fireworks is a pretty lame sub-title. But I like the idea of playing tales. I would like him better as a just [Gandalf] because there are so many great tales in [Shire], [Elven], and [Dwarven] subsets...I wouldn't want [Shire] to be a spot-able race when using him in a Council of Elrond deck, let's say.
Eomer with a built-in stronger version of Help in Doubt and Need. I don't think you need to make it +3. And why not just twilight -1 while you can spot any man as opposed to just [Gondor]?
Aragorn, Estel is a very cool card. But I think that I like him better as a [Gondor] companion that would be in Elven decks. I think you can get away with him being strength 8. Another thought, why not make him work with Elven Telepathy decks, similar to Elrond, Venerable Lord and other Mount Doom elves? Like:
At the start of each skirmish involving Aragorn, you may reveal the top card of your draw deck. If it is an [Elven] card, heal a companion. If it is a [Gondor] card, wound a minion.
Something like that would be a very cool card for Mount Doom Elf-type decks.
Aragorn, Thorongil (your version) should still be vitality 4. Or, make him a 7/3 [3] companion. But I'd just prefer him maintaining his 8/4 [4] statistics.
Gandalf, Steward of Men is, alas, a lame subtitle. Also, it is basically a built-in version of Strength of Spirit...I feel like you could probably come up with something a little more creative.
Anyways, to recap (sorry for reviewing these out of order...I was kind of coming up with thoughts and changing others as I went), I am not sure I am cool with multi-cultural companions (although it creative). I think I'd just prefer companions like Faramir, Wizard's Pupil and Aragorn, Defender of Free Peoples and other similar companions that work with multiple cultures.
Or, maybe I'll just start packing Orc Insurgent in all of my decks again like I did in Towers Standard where every deck seemed to be of the Rainbow variety!
-wtk
-
It's taken me a bit of time, but I've fleshed out this idea enough to make it worth posting (I think). I'm sure a bunch of people have tried out things like this, but here is my interpretation of multiculture cards. As in cards that are two cultures at once. I've only come up with companions so far, but there's a bunch, so I don't feel I'm skimping out on this post at all.
Just to be clear, the rules for these guys are simply that they count as a companion of each of their cultures. For example, the first Aragorn is an [elven] Man, an [elven] Companion, a [gondor] Man, and a [gondor] Companion. And for what it's worth, I imagine the background of the card to be split down the middle (line drawn top to bottom), with one culture's colours on one side and the other culture's on the right. Like hybrid cards in Magic, for anyone who knows what they look like.
[4] •Aragorn, Estel [elven][gondor]
Companion • Man
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 8
Each time an Elf wins a skirmish, make Aragorn strength +1 until the regroup phase.
Estel, meaning hope, is the name given to Aragorn by Elrond when he was accepted into Elrond's household. He's a little smaller than usual partly because of his strength boost, and partly because this is a younger Aragorn.
[4] •Aragorn, Thorongil [gondor][rohan]
Companion • Man
Str 8, Vit 3, Res 8
While you can spot another [gondor] Man, Aragorn is defender +1.
While you can spot another [rohan] Man, Aragorn is damage +1.
Again, I felt a younger Aragorn shouldn't be quite as beefy as the in-his-prime (considering he lived to 200 (?), 85 seems to be in his prime) version of the books. And I can't think up a better name for him, so let me know if you can.
[3] •Eomer, Renewer of Oaths [gondor][rohan]
Companion • Man
Str 7, Vit 3, Res 6
While you can spot a [gondor] Man, Eomer's twilight cost is -1.
Skirmish: Exert Eomer and a [gondor] Man to make a [rohan] Man strength +3, or exert Eomer and a [rohan] Man to make a [gondor] Man strength +3.
If I understand the rules correctly, the way this is worded allows Eomer to exert twice to pump a companion, and allows Eomer to pump himself. The oath referred to is Eorl's oath to the stewards, which Eomer renewed to the newly crowned King.
[4] •Gandalf, Master of Fireworks [gandalf][shire]
Companion • Wizard
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Fellowship: Exert Gandalf and add [1] to play a tale from your draw deck.
I'm not really sure how powerful his ability is ... maybe it should cost nothing or [2]?
[4] •Gandalf, Steward of Men [gandalf][gondor]
Companion • Wizard
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Response: If a Man would exert, exert Gandalf to place no wound for that exertion.
Same comment as above.
[4] •Gandalf, Stormcrow [gandalf][rohan]
Str 7, Vit 4, Res 7
Fellowship: Exert Gandalf twice to discard a Shadow condition (and if that condition was borne by a companion, heal that companion).
And again. Also, I think this name is okay since Stormcrow has been used on two cards (according to the database), neither of which look tournament legal. But other names are welcome anyway.
[2] •Gimli, Elf-Friend [dwarven][elven]
Companion • Dwarf
Str 6, Vit 3, Res 6
Damage +1.
Skirmish: Exert Gimli to make an Elf strength +1 (or +2 if that Elf is Legolas).
I think Gimli and Legolas (see if you can guess his game text without looking :P) are the simplest two of the multiculture companions ... they work best in a deck of the opposite race, and are able to spotted by (some) cards of both cultures.
[2] •Legolas, Friend of Dwarves [dwarven][elven]
Companion • Elf
Str 6, Vit 3, Res 6
Archer.
Skirmish: Exert Legolas to make a Dwarf strength +1 (or +2 if that Dwarf is Gimli).
Were you right?
[1] •Smeagol, Stoor of Gladden Fields [gollum][shire]
Companion • Hobbit
Str 3, Vit 4, Res 5
Stealth events and conditions are twilight cost -1.
Finally, we have this guy. Notice that he's also been given a race ... too many shire cards spot Hobbits to make him effective otherwise. And if an Elendil card can be made, a Smeagol card set a far shorter time in the past can also be made.
Let me know what you think. I'm going to try to come up with a few non-companion cards, and possibly some shadow cards. If any of you have your own takes on this type of cards, I think it could be interesting to compare, so feel free to post them too.
I've done similar things in the past. What I've sometimes ended up doing is the concept of a "culture keyword" - this is mainly for virtual cards when you can't change the background colour of the card - which makes any extra cultures part of the card's game text. What I've also done is simply off-culture characters, like Aragorn, Defender of Rohan, which indeed we'll eventually see in my DC set. And I've also made straight dual culture cards, as well as cards that gain the cultures of other cards (like Friend to Gandalf which grants the [Gandalf] culture to a companion, The Mouth of Sauron which comes into play and gets the culture of another Shadow card and other similar ideas). Obviously these different approaches have their merits, and yours is very clean. It also allows you to do interesting things like slapping toil on your multiculture cards, and any other keywords that care about culture (you could make a version of MTG chroma or conspire, for example).
As for individual cards, if Thorongil has vitality 3, then your flavour also justifies that Estel has to have the same (given that he's an even younger version of Aragorn than the former).
Big fan of Éomer.
Master of Fireworks probably ought to be once per fellowship phase or at the start of the fellowship phase, and you might want to specify "condition" just so we don't get into complicated things with NFFatRoD and similar tale events.
I love Steward of Men, and Stormcrow looks fine because it's a fellowship action.
Gimli and Legolas are OK, but as ket says you could think of something more interesting! My cross-culture versions of Legolas/Gimli normally swap round archer and damage +1 and have triggers like "Each time Gimli wins a skirmish, you may make an [Elven] companion strength +2 until the regroup phase".
I think Sméagol is fine being a Hobbit, but I do think he should still add a burden (or possibly exert a [Shire] companion) to play.
Altogether, great stuff!
Thranduil