The Last Homely House
Middle-Earth => Bag End => Topic started by: Air Power on December 15, 2012, 04:59:20 AM
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Warning (in case you missed it in the title) this post contains spoilers for The Hobbit
Good stuff:
the music. Score was great, and the songs were awesome. The best part of the movie.
Bad stuff:
Poor use of 3D. If I wanted stuff thrown at my face, I'd watch a 90s 3D movie. Mr. Jackson seems to think that the best way to utilize revolutionary improvements in filming technology is to repeat the cheapest, lowest uses of the past.
Radagast. An Istari modeled after a squirrel and used for comic relief.
Thorin is a hater. Seriously, why does he hate so much? "I'll make the quest fail because I don't want to talk to an elf." "I hate this burgler who's done exactly what I hired him for". Also, the finally liking Bilbo scene was cliche beyond belief.
Gollum/Smeagol conflict. A split personality makes sense when he's responding to Frodo's kindness. But remember how Smeagol wasn't a nice person in the first place? So why is there a "nice Smeagol" personality?
The white orc. I guess he's there to milk the book into three movies?
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The movie looked like crap if you watched it in 2D as well. I don't think it would've been that bad, had it not been for the fact that we'll inevitably compare it to Lord of the Rings, given it's made by the same people. Also, the goblin king... God what were they thinking...
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Anyone who went to see The Hobbit with expectations of Lord of the Rings will always be disappointed, because they are two fundamentally different stories in terms of length, complexity, and target audience.
If you watch The Hobbit without preconceived notions, it passes the eyeball test. It was everything I was expecting it to be -- a fun, mostly light-hearted adventure that tells the story of Bilbo Baggins in a way that a child would be able to understand the thematic elements (value of belonging, mercy, friendship, love of nature) pretty easily.
Honestly, I feel like people are being contrary because it's a trendy position to take. The movie is good. Go see it. Just don't expect it to be the same kind of tale as Lord of the Rings, because the book wasn't -- nor was it ever meant to be.
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The movie was great! HL has a good point. The Hobbit was written for a very young target audience. Regardless, PJ did his best to make a very entertaining movie. He did a great job developing characters that never even had a role in the book. Thorin's hatred was warranted. He had suffered a very painful loss at the hands of the elves, he is a dwarf (thus notoriously stubborn), and carried a hatred of elves from ages before. Dare I say it is akin to religious disputes in our own day (a certain middle eastern region which has been at war for a very long time comes to mind).
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Radigast:
They nailed him. As I recall, he was a slightly eccentric, nature loving, forgetful wizard. As for the comic relief, it was all in character.
Smeagol/Gollum:
A bit of creative liberty taken here, but it was the same for lotr. I don't think it was a poor choice. Kept some continuity.
3D:
Everything that was not animated was great. I could see texture in the characters faces and such. Some of the animated stuff was thrown in your face, but it was few enough and far between that I honestly didn't even notice it. I had more issue getting used to the 48 fps, made it look almost like a documentary filming. I mostly got used to it by half way through the movie, but the jury is still out on that point.
White orc: A bit more creative liberty that IMHO did not detract from the story. Could have been left out, but it works.
Thorin: They leave his character open for growth. If they play it right in the next movies, I think it'll work. The characters shouldn't be static, and I think they are setting him up reasonably well.
Music: I'll agree with you here :)
Goblin King: I agree here, he was a little over the top. The way I justify it in my head is the whole "Target Audience" bit. Overall I loved the goblins, but yeah. He could have been much better.
Other thoughts: Trolls were great! That whole scene was pretty sweet. Bilbo should have been allowed to delay longer though.
Dwarf Song: Needed to be longer!
Impossible survivals: You know what I mean. Stone Giants, falling through into goblin cave, ect. So over the top, but I guess it fit pretty well still. Realism wasn't the goal for sure.
Elven King (can't remember his name, only in the beginning of the movie. He didn't help out when Smaug came): This is how I picture an elf. Legolas was not. Elrond wasn't either. Galadriel was very good. This guy was perfect. Elf to the T.
Thats it for now. Overall I really liked it, I think it'll be even better second time around now that I'm a little more used to 48 fps and have more accurate expectations.
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I really liked it. The dwarves were great. And I agree that the Eleven King(Thranduil I think) was awesome looking. Can't wait to see Smaug though. And everything else. Azog seemed to obviously digital to me. The Goblin king almost looked more real then him. But that's just me. My favorite part was Gollum I would have to say. The stone giants were cool looking but they didn't seem to matter at all. I haven't read the book in a while but I am going to now.
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Everything was awful. I'm still in shock that I didn't like it, since it never once occurred to me that I might. This should not have happened.
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My only minor complaint was that Azog looked too much like Kratos. Kinda distracting.
Loved:
-The riddle game. That was one area I was worried about when I went into the theater, but I was blown away by how it was done. Gollum's good personality piping up and saying "We knows the answer!" got a big laugh out of the audience.
-Saruman's scene. Nuff said.
-The wargs. They looked soooo much better than they did in TTT.
-The dinner party.
-Elrond's introduction.
-Thranduil!
-The brief glimpses we got of Smaug.
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i was worried the film was going to end up being gandy, bilbo and gimli x13. however, my hat is off to PJ, i loved how he made each dwarf unique and gave them each a special weapon. kudos!
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Everything was awful. I'm still in shock that I didn't like it, since it never once occurred to me that I might. This should not have happened.
Did we see the same movie? With the exception of the Goblin King, which was a little underwhelming, I thoroughly enjoyed the movie. It was entertaining and I thought PJ did a masterful job weaving the elements from the appendices and the Silmarillion into the film.
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Radigast:
They nailed him. As I recall, he was a slightly eccentric, nature loving, forgetful wizard. As for the comic relief, it was all in character.
I have to agree. In fact, I think Radagast was my favorite character in the movie, bird poop and all! lol that <snip> still cracks me up. I love the bit where Saruman is trash-talking Radagast, and Gandalf is defending him, but looks a bit embarrassed at the same time.
Smeagol/Gollum:
A bit of creative liberty taken here, but it was the same for lotr. I don't think it was a poor choice. Kept some continuity.
I thought Gollum was great, much better animation than the LOTR trilogy, the character felt much more "real" to me. Great performance, too.
Goblin King: I agree here, he was a little over the top. The way I justify it in my head is the whole "Target Audience" bit. Overall I loved the goblins, but yeah. He could have been much better.
One of my few complaints. That guy was a little too cartoonish for my taste, and his final words, "That'll do it!" were too cute I thought.
My only other complaint: The Witch-king attacking Radagast at Dol Guldur: Didn't feel like a consistent portrayal of the ring-wraiths, to me. Unless I'm mistaken, the ring-wraiths are not disembodied ghostly spirits, they're more like zombies whose bodies have been rendered permanently invisible by their rings of power.
Other than those few things, thought it was great! It was amazing how fast that nearly-3-hours flew by. My wife thought the movie was only half over, when suddenly the credits rolled.
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Point of Order in regards to the witch-king: At that point in the saga, the Nazgul were incapable of existing in the daylight. However, in the film, it was all clouded so one could argue it "wasn't" daytime.
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I have minor complaints, but overall I really loved it and can't wait to see it again. I'm a huge fan of the new 3D in general, but this was (obviously) my first experience with 48FPS. For the first 5 minutes it felt a bit off, but after that I was used to it and was really stunned by the visuals. The landscapes in this were frankly even better than what they did in Lotr.
The movie certainly has a slightly more whimsical tone to it than did Lotr, but I think that is a good thing, considering there is also a tonal difference in the written stories.
Bilbo, Gandalf, and the dwarves were all awesome!
Hurray for prologues!! Erebor was better than I had ever imagined it would be!
Radagast was maybe a bit silly, but he still worked for me.
Really, you just have to separate the films out from the books and enjoy them each for what they are. That goes for Lotr as well.
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And the bunny sled was awesome. Anyone who says otherwise is a blasphemer!
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Thought the Movie was awesome, kind of childish in the beginning but its a childrens book so wasnt mad. love Graham playing Dwalin. Upset at CGI, too much of it, and Azog should be like Lurtz or Ugluk, not the guy from I am legend haha. Upset Azog is still alive..... and the white council at being so stunned about the witch king.... you guys already know. and thorin jumping down at the end and bilbo saving the day, ugh. oh and cgi again..... Music was amazing, looks were amazing, just everything was great, 8/10. Oh and cgi again.... and not showing Gandalf getting the map from thorins dad made me upset, hopefully they show it in a flashback in the second or third movie.
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dol guldur was awesome! radagast was a little too dopey, yet for some reason he was still one of my favorite parts of the movie.
i don't get why Azog is in there. didn't really feel like he added to the movie. plus right when you think thorin is going to kick butt, he gets beat up! and bilbo goes and kicks butt! WTF!?!?!?!
they changed the troll scene a little too much imo. and also they left out some riddles!!!
all in all, i had an enjoyable time, LOVED the part where gandalf can't remember the names of the blue wizards, but it felt less awesome than lord of the rings. the art and makeup didn't seem as extensive, but rather felt more like cgi. in fact, the whole goblin scene felt like a video game.
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Nah, Azog was needed in order to alleviate one of the book's chief complaints, that it feels like a series of episodes rather than an ongoing story. First the dinner party, then the trolls, then Rivendell, then the mountains, then Gollum, etc. And it gives Thorin a better character arc for the first movie.
Plus, it is very apparent that Azog will lead the Orc army at the Battle of Five Armies, so it's better to introduce him early.
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Smaug taking Erebor at the beginning :up:
Dwalin meeting Balin, the headbutt. :up:
The Oakenshield :up:
Dwarves :up:
Bilbo :up:
Trolls :up:
Azog :down:
Goblin King :down:
Radagast :-k ... 8-)
Bunny sled :up:
Wargs :up:
Eagles :up:
Movie exceded my expectations. Well done PJ.
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I see a lot of people giving grief about tje Goblin King, and while it was definitely not my favorite part of the movie, if anyone has ever seen the old Warner Bros. Hobbit animation from the... late 80s, maybe? The Goblin King is quite similar to what was shown in the movie, and equally underwhelming, so I think they actually relived it pretty well.
Also, as far as the 48fps is concerned, I absolutely loved it. It's weird at first, it seems you're watching a good videogame cutscene from an HD title like Final Fantasy or such, but once you get used to it, it's really smooth and cool. Also, when I saw fires up close, at the end, that's when I was really sold for good, that was one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen on a big screen, and the whole idea of watching on the big screen is exactly that, to have an amazing experience, otherwise, with all the surround technology, HD, huge-screened TVs and etc, unless the big screen provides an awesome experience, it might not be worth leaving the conforts of your home just for "seen it first" bragging rights (I still have nightmares about going to the pre-launch screening of New Moon with my wife - what can I say? she deserves it -, all those 12/14-year-olds screaming... brrrr... the horror....).
As far as the White Orc goes, that iron sticking ot of his elbow is like nails on a chalkboard for me, not sure why, but overall I liked how the "oakenshield" thing was done, and he was a great part of it, so I'll take it.
I absolutely loathed Radagast, though. His sled even more.
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You know, Decipher was really ahead of their time when they made the Radagast card. Thanks to the bunny sled, the "move limit +1" text now makes more sense!
Besides....
(https://lotrtcgwiki.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-prn1%2F15573_10151366821431221_392112467_n.jpg&hash=49ebfd1c1ce43a9474a50ae25b95138b352f31b5)
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@FM. I saw that Hobbit cartoon to many times when I was younger. And that goblin king is the best. Haha.
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I hated the "toilet flush" effect when he got killed, though. And how Smaug resembled a cat. *shudder*
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Yes, I died a little inside when that song didn't make it to the screens, easily the most awesome moment in the cartoon, I still sing it in RPG sessions when they climb up a tree for whatever reason, and one time I actually DID send fire-wielding wargs after them, so it scares the sh** out of them. Good times...
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No way, this is the best song from the cartoon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqDksugN2mw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqDksugN2mw)
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I REALLY did not like Radagast's bunny sled, especially because of how they used it to mislead the wargs. That whole action sequence was a little hokey, and not very convincing at all....I always pictured Radagast as crazy, but there was no need to add something that "unrealistic" into the LOTR/Middle Earth film legendarium, especially when PJ's LOTR movies are praised for being *relatively* realistic, with keen attention to detail.
I have to say the early Dwarven history sections were my favorite. Seeing all those shiny Dwarven warriors fighting was great. I was hoping to see the full sequence with Azog (money bag, fleeing Dwarf, etc) but I guess that would have been too dark for kids. I remember reading it in the LOTR Appendices as an eight year old, and shuddering at the decapitation of the old king.