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DáinIronfoot

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:52 pm

Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4594 Location: Beltsville, MD, USA

Considering that all cards posted in the Duos so far have been from my first set, Lasting Alliances, and I still have FOUR more sets in various stages of completion, I wanted to get started on one other to run parallel and get through all of them some time before I die. Laughing

And I figured hitting Duo #100 deserved some celebrating, so this seemed as good a time to start as any. Very Happy

For now, I don’t have a projected cardlist or number of cards for each culture, but I can say this: like all my sets, The Road Ahead is focused on the old-school cultures and several old-school strategies. It doesn’t ignore the post-Shadows world though...in fact, it attempts to blend the old and the new. Where else will you find signets and resistance co-existing? Moria

and

Orcs stomping around together? Where else will you find rainbow fellowships being encouraged, and even working!

I’ll get into more specifics later, but try the thread for this set’s predecessor, Lasting Alliances, for a description of some of my sets’ new (and old Smile

) strategies.

This set is not nearly as close to completion as Lasting Alliances, but it’s coming along. I’ll do this like most people do their sets: one culture at a time.

To start, let’s go with Shire

. In this set, many of the Shire

cards focus on the early "fellowship", where it was all Hobbits (sometimes with a certain wizard or ranger thrown in). That doesn’t mean they’re limited to Hobbit-exclusive or even Hobbit-heavy fellowships, but they certainly DO work well together.

I think it’d be wrong to start with anybody other than Frodo and Sam, so here they are!

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Ringed Resistance: 10
Ring-bearer. Ring-bound.
Frodo may bear any card that plays on Bilbo.
Bilbo may bear any card that plays on Frodo.
Maneuver or Skirmish: Add a burden to have Frodo take off The One Ring.
“‘I am not made for perilous quests. I wish I had never seen the Ring! Why did it come to me? Why was I chosen?’”

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

to heal Sam.
Response: If Frodo or Bilbo is killed while bearing The One Ring, make Sam the Ring-bearer; he is resistance -5.
“‘He’s in and out of Bag End. Crazy about stories of the old days he is, and he listens to all Mr. Bilbo’s tales. Mr. Bilbo has learned him his letters – meaning no harm, mark you, and I hope no harm will come of it.’”

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

Companions • Hobbits
Strength: 6
Vitality: 4
Ringed Resistence: 12
If Frodo & Sam are the Ring-bearer, each time they exert or take a wound, add a burden.
Response: If a Shadow condition is about to be played on Frodo & Sam, exert them to discard it instead.
“‘A nice pickle we have landed ourselves in, Mr. Frodo!’”

Last edited by DáinIronfoot on Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:12 pm; edited 33 times in totalBest regards, Dáin, Vice Aftokrator of the Chosen Ones

Check out Lasting Alliances, The Road Ahead, and Ages of Middle-earth, three of my five dream card sets that make up Wars of the Ring. Oh, and I have a trade list now!

Also, if you're into DCs or RPGs (or even if you're not!), check out Realms of Middle-earth, the sequel to CG's "DC Adventure", Realms of the North!

NBarden

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:57 pm

Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Ringed Resistance: 10
Ring-bearer. Ring-bound.
Each time a threat is added, add a burden.
Skirmish: Add a burden to have Frodo take off The One Ring.
“‘I am not made for perilous quests. I wish I had never seen the Ring! Why did it come to me? Why was I chosen?’”

Completely useless.

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

Companions • Hobbits
Strength: 6
Vitality: 4
Ringed Resistence: 12
If Frodo & Sam are the Ring-bearer, each time they exert or take a wound, add a burden.
Response: If a shadow condition is about to be played on Frodo & Sam, exert them to prevent that.
“‘A nice pickle we have landed ourselves in, Mr. Frodo!’”

Nice. Would Where now the Horse work with this card?

-Trade With Me Exclamation

Add the popcorn smiley to your sig, help it achieve world domination.
What if the hokey pokey really IS what its all about? Shocked

As I lay in bed staring at the stars last night, I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"

Spotlight on....Sense of Obligation.

AnxiousChieftain

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:59 pm

Joined: 15 Jul 2005 Posts: 3947 Location: Maryland

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Wow, I really think that this is underpowered. There are very few cards that force the RB to put on the Ring, and most decks that do[i/] have cards that force the RB to wear it have response cards (Southern Spies, The Twilight World, etc) that would trigger before Frodo’s ability could be used.

So, basically, I think that his skirmish ability is a tad underpowered and his drawback is way too huge to make anyone want to use him.

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

to heal Sam.
Response: If Frodo or Bilbo is killed while bearing The One Ring, make Sam the Ring-bearer; he is resistance -5.
[i]“‘He’s in and out of Bag End. Crazy about stories of the old days he is, and he listens to all Mr. Bilbo’s tales. Mr. Bilbo has learned him his letters – meaning no harm, mark you, and I hope no harm will come of it.’”

I think you can drop the "while bearing The One Ring" part, since a section in the CRD states that Sam can only grab the Ring if Frodo is the RB when he is killed.

Cool card though.

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

WEIRD!!! Double companions... it might be balanced, but I can’t say that I really like the idea. Hmm...

- AC

MODS RULE. - lem0nhead

elf lvr

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 5:10 pm

Joined: 13 Jun 2006 Posts: 3065 Location: Rivendell

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Ringed Resistance: 10
Ring-bearer. Ring-bound.
Maneuver or Skirmish: Add a burden to have Frodo take off The One Ring.
“‘I am not made for perilous quests. I wish I had never seen the Ring! Why did it come to me? Why was I chosen?’”
Wow. Pretty cool. This could break down some strategies.

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

Happy Hunting! Elf Lvr
Winner of Best Personality in the FPCA. Thanks!
Archduke Elf Lvr - Archidoux of the Chosen Ones
AMV Maker In-Training! Check out my newest production, Katsu!- A Diedara Tribute!
And behold, EL declared it good. And there was morning, and there was evening, the first (new) day. ~ DainIronfoot

DáinIronfoot

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 6:10 pm

Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4594 Location: Beltsville, MD, USA

I made changes to Frodo, for those who may not have seen yet. Apparently EL likes it...how about the rest?

s for those reviews as soon as I can get them to you. For now, I think it’s time to post my LONG idea behind Dual-Character cards.

A dual-character card, such as Frodo & Sam, is a single card that represents two characters. This means that if a card requires you to spot characters, you may spot either character on that card or spot both. In the case of Frodo & Sam, a card requiring you to spot two Shire

companions or two Hobbits would be satisfied by this one dual-character card, since it represents two distinct characters even though it is a single card. However, because it IS a single card, the two characters are considered to be “joined at the hip”, per se. Anything that happens to one of the characters on a dual-character card automatically happens to the other. For example, if one character is killed, the other character also dies. If you have Boromir & Faramir in play and a card that targets Faramir is played, Boromor is affected also. If a card allows you to play one of the characters on a dual-character card for a reduced cost, both characters on that card are played at the reduced cost. And so on.

On a dual-character card, the two characters represented have a single strength, vitality, and signet/resistance/site. Strength is considered to be the combined variables of those characters, though in some cases it may be higher or lower than the actual combination of those characters’ strength from the game. Merry & Pippin, who are normally 3 strength individually, combine for a total of 6 strength on their dual-character card. Legolas & Gimli, however, who are both 6 strength by themselves, combine for only 11 rather than 12. Also note that, since these numbers are combined, any card that boosts one character’s strength automatically boosts the other’s. If a Dwarven Axe is played on Gimli from Legolas & Gimli, for example, they now combine for 13 strength rather than 11. If the Bow of the Galadhrim is then played on Legolas, with its strength +1 boost, Legolas & Gimli now combine for a total of 14 strength, and of course special abilities from BOTH weapons may be used by this single card.

Vitality, unlike strength, is typically not a combined number for dual-character cards. For Merry & Pippin, who normally both have a vitality of 4 by themselves, the dual-character card also has a vitality of only 4. The reason vitality is not combined while strength is lies in how a dual-character card acts in battle. If (a “single-character card” version of) Merry were to skirmish an Orc, his strength would be matched against that Orc, and if it were lower than the Orc’s strength, he would lose, thus taking a wound. If Pippin were to join that same battle, he would add his strength to Merry’s, and that combined strength would be matched against that Orc. If their combined strength was still lower, both would lose and both would take a wound. Thus on a dual-character card, the strength is combined and the vitality is not...just as it works if those characters are acting independently.

Twilight cost IS typically combined (thus, as you might have guessed, dual-character cards tend to be quite pricey), though like strength, it may be higher or lower than one would expect. Note again that cards that reduce twilight cost (or increase it, for that matter) apply to both characters on a dual-character card. Cards that lower the twilight cost of Gondor

Men by 1, for instance, would reduce Boromir & Faramir’s cost by 2, not just 1, since both individual characters fit the condition (being a Gondor

Man). A card doing the same for Elves would only reduce the cost by 1 for Legolas & Gimli; Legolas, as an Elf, qualifies, while Gimli, as a Dwarf, clearly does not.

In the case of companions, the signet or resistance number applies to both companions on a dual-character card. If another signet is added, such as with the Horn of the Mark, or the resistance number is changed, this change applies to both companions. For minions, the site number is also the same for both on a dual-character card. Both minions are roaming if played before their site, thus counting as two roaming minions even though it is one card. If another card has an affect on roaming minions, such as a strength addition or subtraction, it is applied to both minions. For example, if Advance Captain were to be played and that shadow player had a dual-character roaming Sauron

Orc, that dual-character card would receive a combined damage +2, not a single damage +1. (Note again, though, that possessions are a bit of an exception to this rule. A possession that makes a Gondor

Man damage +1, when played on Boromir & Faramir, would result in that dual-character being damage +1 rather than damage +2, since both characters cannot bear that weapon.) This is also true of strength and defender bonuses, but not vitality, since again, that is not a combined number. A card boosting all minions’ vitality by 1 would only add one vitality to our dual-character Sauron Orc, not two. The addition of keywords such as ranger, archer, valiant, enduring, and muster also apply only once (unless explicitly noted otherwise), since the combined characters are considered to be a single ranger or archer, muster applies to one specific character unless otherwise noted, and in the case of enduring, the characters take wounds together and have combined strength that is boosted when they take a wound.

Dual-character cards are obviously very powerful, but there are a number of serious risks to consider as well. As mentioned before, cards that affect one character on such a card affect both. In some cases, such as cards that allow you to discard a character rather than place it in the dead pile, this is a good thing. In such a case, both characters would be discarded together. However, with a card that does something nasty if two unbound Hobbits can be spotted, Merry & Pippin definitely qualify. Or worse still, if a card kills or discard a character on a dual-character card (and you don’t WANT it discarded this time!), you lose both characters at once. Ouch. Cards that let the opponent discard a card from your hand sound particularly nasty now, as you lose two characters if they pick a dual-character card. Double ouch.

Dual-character cards can be an interesting and, played properly, powerful addition to both sides of the table. Just understand that with their appeal comes new hazards, also. Play with dual-characters at your own risk!

Best regards, Dáin, Vice Aftokrator of the Chosen Ones

Check out Lasting Alliances, The Road Ahead, and Ages of Middle-earth, three of my five dream card sets that make up Wars of the Ring. Oh, and I have a trade list now!

Also, if you're into DCs or RPGs (or even if you're not!), check out Realms of Middle-earth, the sequel to CG's "DC Adventure", Realms of the North!

NBarden

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 6:50 pm

Joined: 28 Dec 2006 Posts: 5468 Location: I don't know...

Hm...interesting. I think I like it. Sometimes. Can Dual Characters bear two possessions of each class, such as Legolas and Gimli bearing the Long-Knives of Legolas and Gimli’s Battleaxe?

Quick as may be is suddenly very playable...and Focus would heal Legolas...in a roundabout way...

-Trade With Me Exclamation

Add the popcorn smiley to your sig, help it achieve world domination.
What if the hokey pokey really IS what its all about? Shocked

As I lay in bed staring at the stars last night, I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"

Spotlight on....Sense of Obligation.

Mouth of Saruman

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 7:55 pm

Joined: 14 Feb 2007 Posts: 190 Location: Orthanc

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Underpowered. Maybe tie him in with Bilbo or Gandalf; that would make it better.

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

The title seems somewhat familiar ( Wink

), but very cool. No complaints on this Sam.

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

Bravo for giving this a try. There are still some issues. First off, capitalize "Shadow" in the response ability. Second, concerning dual-character cards, NBarden makes a good point. Can they bear two possessions of the same type? If so, that could be a little powerful; throw a Sting, Weapon of Heritage and Hobbit Sword on Frodo and Sam and suddenly they’re strength 10! Interesting.

for the idea as soon as I can muster it.

DáinIronfoot

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:29 pm

Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4594 Location: Beltsville, MD, USA

NBarden wrote:

Hm...interesting. I think I like it. Sometimes. Can Dual Characters bear two possessions of each class, such as Legolas and Gimli bearing the Long-Knives of Legolas and Gimli’s Battleaxe?

Yes. They are on the same card, but they are still two different characters. However, I’m getting the feeling people think that’s too good?

I made some changes to Frodo, by the way, as MoS suggested. Is he better now?

BattleWarg

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 9:38 pm

Joined: 11 Feb 2007 Posts: 579 Location:

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo, Favorite Nephew and Heir Shire

Interesting... Consorting with wizards...
I can’t think of any specific problems. I like the general idea. But don’t most of the cards that say one or the other also use their name in the abilities?
Or (just as an example), something that says "Bearer must be Frodo. He is damage +1." A question that would probably be raised is whether the ’he’ refers to Frodo or Bearer. I’m not exactly sure how to word it (like your Legolas, probably)...

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Sam, Eavesdropper Shire

Companion • Hobbit
Strength: 3
Vitality: 4
Resistance: 10
Ring-bound.
Each time you play a tale or stealth card, you may add

So, Sam can take the ring from Bilbo...
I’m trying to figure out if a Frodo that can take the Ring from Bilbo would make this all better or too powerful. This does make sense, though, and I like it. I’d probably use it in tale/stealth decks, and not much otherwise... Possibly Ring-bound Ranger with Bilbo Ring-bearer...

DáinIronfoot wrote:

•Frodo & •Sam, Inseparable Shire

Yikes... Should they be able to prevent transfers to them or no?

Also, I might have just missed the part on it, and it seems like a basic question, but do dual-characters take up one or two slots in the fellowship/dead pile?

Our time here is ending...

What did you want to see before the end?
It will be made in the Request-a-card Set #1 (name ideas also welcome Smile

Mouth of Saruman

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:32 pm

Joined: 14 Feb 2007 Posts: 190 Location: Orthanc

DáinIronfoot wrote:

I made some changes to Frodo, by the way, as MoS suggested. Is he better now?

Much.

I don’t think that dual-characters being able to bear two possessions can be too powerful, but it could get out of hand, depending on how many dual-characters there are.

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