Cascading Kicker

[Thranduil]

Okay, say I play Bloodbraid Elf or whatever and cascade into Burst Lightning. Cascade says that I can "cast without paying its mana cost" Burst Lightning. When I cast it, I can choose to kick it. Do I have to pay the kicker cost? Or does that count as it's "mana cost" and so do I get it for free?

Similarly, Chandra Ablaze casts red instants or sorceries from your graveyard without paying their mana costs, like Elemental Appeal and Burst Lightning. I get the option to kick them, but do I get to do it for free?

Thranduil

[Sete]

Nope. It's like the X option. That way you could simply say: "hey, for the X cost, I want to pay 50..." With Cascade you get the CARD cost for free. Any kicker, X cost, action cost or any additional costs are up to you... Cascades are good to pull more cascades and end up with a lightning bolt or so.

[lem0nhead]

Yeah the kicker is part of the gametext not the cost. Doesnt work sorry.

[Thranduil]

So if you cast a Fireball from your graveyard with Chandra Ablaze, you get to choose the value of X (as long as you tap that mana)? What about if you cascade into Fireball - do you have to choose X as 0 or do you get to tap any amount of mana?

Thranduil

[FM]

No, whenever you cast a spell with X in its mana cost WITHOUT paying its mana cost, X = 0, and you can't choose a different value even if you have mana available. Actually, X = 0 in ANY area of the game, except the stack. A Fireball will have a converted mana cost of 1 while in your hand, in your graveyard, in your sideboard, outside of the game and in your library. On the stack, a Fireball will have a converted mana cost of 1+X, with X being what you've paid for it.

[Thranduil]

Okay cool. So you can choose to pay extra kicker costs, but you can't choose to pay .

Thranduil

[lem0nhead]

Thats is how id interpret it.

[Sete]

Okay cool. So you can choose to pay extra kicker costs, but you can't choose to pay .

Thranduil

Right you are! X is always = 0 unless you pay for it from your hand. It's like the "converted mana cost" of a card. If the card costs "X 2R", the converted mana cost is 3, so they assume right there that the X cost is 0. A card with kicker BB and mana cost 4BB, will have a converted mana cost of 6, (from the 4BB). Kicker is just a mechanic of the game. Thranduil, we gotta play a bit one of these days. I'll try to install the mtg on GCCG!

(my X = 50 was sarcastic back there guess I should've said it... lol)

[FM]

Okay cool. So you can choose to pay extra kicker costs, but you can't choose to pay .

Thranduil

No. When you announce you're casting a spell and start to pay its cost, that's the time you make any choices (and pay any extra costs for them). Since you don't pay the cost, you don't get to make any choices related to it, like buyback, kicker, etc. So you can't kick a spell played without paying its mana cost.

[Thranduil]

Thanks FM! And Sete, how did you get GCCG to work on your mac?

Thranduil

[Sete]

Thranduil, I installed parallels program and then ran Windows Black Edition (the light windows) and used GCCG with it But a warning... it's quite difficult to work in it :/ cause all the symbols are mixed up, the shift zoom and phases selection are near impossible and also using the mouse (if you own a mac mouse) makes the game a bad experience...

Conclusion: Now I only play at night, when I get home, in my pc...

(unless my house mates decide to do some idiocy in gccg while Im away -.-)