Report International Tournament, Amsterdam May 1rst 2010

[Smeagollum]

Well here the promised report of our tournament in Amsterdam. Allthough with a lot of prizesupport there were only 6 participants: Menno Kronenberg, André Kleine, Henk Maul (yes that's his real name), Erwin van Velzen, Erik Steen hart and myself (as tournament organizer and judge).

Menno played a Dwarven fellowship based on possesions and discard combined with a Sauron Discard/innitiative/burden with gollum as shadow.
Henk Maul played two decks: Dwarven possesions combined with a twillight Nazgul as shadow; Elven Archery with Sauron exert/archery.
Erik played: Knights/moria (a bit classic moria)
André did Elven telepathy/classic moria (same shadow as Eric)
Erwin had a variant of Kralik's deck Dsodf: Same shadow, but the fellowship contained only 3 cultures: Dwarven. Gondor and Elven with Boromir as rb and more focussed to Archery.
I played an experimental Rohan fellowship (which didn't worked out as I hoped for) with a Sauron/Nazgul Innitiative/burden with Gollum as shadow.

We just did only 3 rounds. André went 3-0 winning (Erik, Erwin and Menno). Second came Menno 2-1 (with wins on me and Erwin). 3rd was Erik (with a win on me). I was 4th (I had a narrow escape on Henk's Nazgul). Erwin 5th (Henk was outrunned) and Henk became 6th with a win on Eric.

Previous to the start of the tournament I wasn't sure which deck I would play; I had also a Dauntless Hunter/smeagol Felloship with Dunlend site control/archery with me. So I said to Erik to throw the dice oneven would be Rohan/burden and even Dh/Dunland. He throwed a five so I had to play Rohan. My first match was against Henk. Against me he played Dwarven Nazgul. My Fellowship didn't work that well, but with this deck I know that if I survive untill seven then I will corrupt on 8 or 9. Luckely for me I got innitiative with Mordor fighter and Gorgoroth Stormer and had also Ulaire Attea, Wraith on Wings and an Ulaire Attea, Wraith on Wings with  some The Ring is Mine! in hand. So I was able to corrupt Henk on site 6 before he corrupted me. After this match Henk switched decks and had a fun moment against Erwin by using Terrible as the Dawn against Erwin's galadriel (a bit unfair, because Henk knew what Erwin would play and he switched his deck just for this trick; but despite that it is fun to kill Galadriel with that tech).
My second match was against Erik. He played knights, but didn't give any poule (he almost didn't play anything even no 5th companion). I wasn't able to give him threats early in the game with Ulaire cantea and I didn't get any captured by the ring. Together with the fact that I didn't get any companions or Simbelmyne made him able to win. I was Overwhelmed by his Moria on site 5 (in the rematch I won by corrupting him on site 5).
My last match was stupid. I played against Menno's discard deck and totally forgot to use the text of Frodo, Courteous Halfling. So Menno was able to use Orc Inquisitor got innitiative used Gorgoroth Stormer and The Ring is Mine! So I lost because of my own stupidity  .

Other menorable fun moment was short after the tournament. André and I had another game. He played his tournament winning deck against my Dh/Smeagol Deck. I controlled 6 sites on site 8 and would played 4 x Southron Archer on site 9  (While his shadow didn't do anything against my fellowship to win he had to walk to site 9 with alreay 2 Dunlend minions on table) and would control (Freca) another site. He gave up.

Can't tell you much about the other matches, because I didn't experienced them. But I had the idea that all of us had a fun time. And I know for sure that Henk's son will be very happy with his father's prizesupport

[Smeagollum]

can somebody make this topic sticky? Thx 

[Smeagollum]

What I forgot to mention is that if you gonna paticipate in this epic event then it might be a nice idea to make it a real big weekend: On the 30th of April we've got Queensday in the Netherlands and then Amsterdam is then one of the places to be with big parties and a market starting on 29th at midnight till 30th of april midnight. And almost all Dutch are then clothed in Orange, which is also an experience an sich (even for some of the dutch themselves)!

[Witchkingx5]

Nice idea, but what about a location to sleep?
2day-tournament sounds good!

[Gil-Estel]

There are youthhostels in the city of course, but that particular weekend is very busy, so probably not cheap as well. We could look in to it. But with reasonable pricing, would you consider coming?

[Witchkingx5]

Of course, the journey could be a bit expensive from Zürich (Switzerland) to Amsterdam and my parents aren't happy at all, but I am planning to!

[Smeagollum]

hi, well hope you'll come! Here is the cheapest flight I could find:

https://lijnvluchten.cheaptickets.nl/transport/BookXpress_Hitchhiker/flights.cfml?parameter=1ziod8238507ff4de.N.1.&Senioren=0&DEP_DATE=2010-04-30&nr_adults=1&Studenten=0&filter_allowAirlines=*&nr_infants=0&DES_APCODE=AMS&DES_APNAME=Amsterdam&Roundtrip=1&ecobusfir=eco&DEP_APCODE=ZRH&DEP_APNAME=Zurich&nr_children=0&DEP2_APCODE=AMS&DEP2_APNAME=Amsterdam&DES2_APCODE=ZRH&DES2_APNAME=Zurich&RET_DATE=2010-05-02

[legolas3333]

uhh ryanair has the cheapest flights, only 1 euro sometimes, and it flies to most major cities

[Smeagollum]

uhh ryanair has the cheapest flights, only 1 euro sometimes, and it flies to most major cities

Does Ryan air fly from Zurich to Amsterdam? And what does it cost?

Can somebody find out what he can do best?

[Witchkingx5]

I actually don't know, If never been in Amsterdam before.

[Gil-Estel]

You should try to commute. If there are others, and I know there are, try to make them come too and travel together. That saves money and is loads of fun.

[Witchkingx5]

Yeah, that would be nice, but I'm actually the only player here in Zürich, so maybe some of München could take the same flight if the airplane lands in München (but it actually should).

[Smeagollum]

But why don't you take the train to munich and go further by car?

[Smeagollum]

Practical question. If I want it to be a legal European tournament shouldn't I need decipher approval to make it official? If so... then who's the person who's in contact with Decipher so that I can contact him to let him contact decipher and ask their approval and some support (maybe warren have some promo's left.. a certain {Rohan} Aragorn for example)?

[TheJord]

I have already asked about that particular card and was told they dont have it

[Smeagollum]

I have already asked about that particular card and was told they dont have it

 Then maybe they have others or some of those large cards. Wouldn't even mind if they send a few boxes fightclub to promote it...

[TheJord]

Sorry I should have said, they dont have ANY LOTR cards left.

[Smeagollum]

Sorry I should have said, they dont have ANY LOTR cards left.

... actually that's quite sad. They made a product and apparently they don't have any feelings to it, otherwise they would have keep some things for themselves.

But back to the topic.. Are you comming Jord?

[Smeagollum]

To see what format would be best for this tournament I've got a few questions:

For Enola, Hawkeyespf and german sections on this board: What do you think of a format which combines movieblock with multipath (as the french use but then with the official x-list) + wow block (so actually the first 14 sets, sets after 14 will be difficult to handlle as it's to rare for new players and to overpowered at this moment). People can choose which adventure deck they use as long as it is from one block: So you can use 9 site from fotr block or 9 from tt, but not combine them). If people use the old sitepaths then the old system is in use if a player uses a generic site then on the moment that site is played the rules for a generic site is in use for this site.
Please your opinion! So it will be easier for me and Gil-estel to determine what we can do best.

[Enola]

I will just discuss about bringing a new format in LOTR TCG.


If you want to create a new format, you have to make it balanced; otherwise after 2-3 tournaments you will always see the same best decks which are played, and it will be really boring.

For example, in Movie Block with the Decipher X-list, there are 3-4 fellows/shadows which are at the top, and the rest far behind.

So you have to bring diversity in competitive decks, and it's not an easy task .
Moreover, the fun decks will be more interesting to play, because you will break the line of the Meta, and that's the goal.
And when your fun decks work, it's more interesting, no ?



About the X-list :

X-listing cards change the Meta, and you can play on X-list to bring new competitive decks

For example, Sam, Son of Hamfast :
If you don't x-list him, you favor alternative Ring-Bearers, cause their will be not real advantages to play Frodo as RB. Moreover, you won't see many corrupt decks in your tournament, cause the power of Sam is too great and that  is a bad point for diversity  .
Another point about this Sam, his x-list "deban" other cards, you will never play Sam, Samwise the Brave (good only for the RB Frodo) or Elf-Song, Extraordinary Resilience, Narya, A Light in His Mind ......

In short, in some cases you bring new cards playable when you x-list certain cards... just think about it.

Other thing, avoid to make your own errata, otherwise there will be too much confusion for players.
And R-List will bring too much luck in game : you have the nice topdeck at the good moment, or a simple Saved will search the right card even if it's R-list.

That's our point of view, here in France, and our format Multipath works really well.

Sure, you can disagree with some x-listed cards, but we voted the x-list democratically in a few assembly of players.

To have something still really playable I can propose :

Take our actual X-list and remove from it :
- • Book of Mazarbul (you can draw 4 cards each turn but it's ok)
- A Talent For Not Being Seen (too denial but it's ok)
- Ford of Bruinen (be careful with Morcs and Nertea, ToTO)
- Emyn Muil (really awesome with Enquea, ToTO but ok)
- Till Durin Wakes Again (Dwarves are healing crazy but ok)
- The Shire Countryside (still there is no infinite loop, you can bring him back, but it's still too powerfull)
- Legolas, DH (bring great Non-Player Experience, but if you absolute want him, take him back)


If you take the 11-14 sets in, there will be all the interactions with the 1-6 sets, that's Expanded and you have to be careful about all the crazy loops.

On this forum, I see no group who tries to bring a new format, a new X-list....


So, be careful if you create a new format .


I hope this will help you.

[Smeagollum]

Thx for your reply. I just want to use the format which bring in the most players. So I'm thinking of a combi between your format and the austrian. So every thought from your side as from the others I asked is helpfull. At this point I'm still concidering 3 formats: Yours, austrian or a combo. On the 28th of february Gil and I will decide which it will be. But as said we want to make it a big tournament with as much players as possible.

My problem with your x-list is that I don't like to x cards. So I'm very carefull with that. Though must say that your point is well overthought (by the way I actually like to play elf-song ).

Still you haven't give your opinion about the combination of those format's (French movieblock + austrian format (minus sets 15, 17 & 18)). Do you think it's doable and do you think people would like to play it?

[Enola]

I propose an alternative X-list as our actual X-list, you can use him, it will be something like that :

0P2 Bill the Pony
0P5 Horn of Boromir
1R40 Elrond, Lord of Rivendell
1R45 Galadriel, Lady of Light
1R80 Ottar, Man of Laketown
1U108 No Stranger to the Shadows
1C138 Saruman's Snows
1R139 Savagery to Match Their Numbers
1R195 Relics of Moria
1U234 Úlairë Nertëa, Messenger of Dol Guldur
1C248 Forces of Mordor
1C311 Sam, Son of Hamfast
1R313 Sting
1C331 Ettenmoors
1U355 Silverlode Banks
2R32 Flaming Brand
2R75 Bill Ferny, Swarthy Sneering Fellow
3R38 Aragorn, Heir To The White City
3R42 Horn of Boromir
3R67 The Palantír of Orthanc
3R68 Saruman, Keeper of Isengard
3U106 Bill the Pony
3C108 Frying Pan
4U338 Golden Hall
4U357 King's Room
7U49 Steadfast Champion
7C96 Gondorian Captain
8C1 Aggression
10U2 Memories of Darkness
10C91 Mordor Fiend
10R11 Galadriel, Lady Redeemed



I know you don't like to x-list cards, but as I said, by x-listing one card, you have many other cards that become playable.

About introducing the sets 11-14 in the Multipath, why not.
But think about all the loops and if the Meta will still be balanced (not a single deck which can auto kill many decks..).
If you use the Austrian method, you can only make decks with 7-14 sets on one way.
And think about the interactions between sets 11-14 and sites TTT and FOTR.

Another point, avoid to make a too complicated format, people prefer simple format.

[Smeagollum]

thx, very helpfull. Gues the choice will be reduced to two

Do you allow rb skirmish cancelling?

And what would you think about the following if we would use movieblock with original x-list:

Errata:
Sam, soh: Game Text: At the start of the Fellowship: Exert Sam to remove a burden. Response: If Frodo dies, make Sam the Ring-bearer (resistance 5).

Galadriel, lr: Game Text: When Galadriel is in your starting fellowship, her twilight cost is -3. At the start of the Fellowship or Regroup: Discard an event from hand to discard a Shadow condition or Shadow possession.

Siterules:
Round 1 + 2: Fotrblock
Round 3 + 4: TTblock
Round 5 + 6: Rotkblock

Optional errata:

Legolas, dh: Game Text: Archer. The twilight cost of each Shadow event is +1 if you can spot Pipin. The twilight cost of each Shadow condition is +1 if you can spot Merry.  The twilight cost of each Shadow event and Shadow condition is +2 if you can spot both Merry and Pipin.

[Witchkingx5]

Well, I think that the following Formats are the Best:

1. Movie
2. Austrian
3. Pre-Hunters (1-14, though)
4. FotR Block
5. TS
And the such called 6. Exchange-block Format A and B:

The Exchange Format is a format I play with my cousin when I visit him on Prague, and it works like this:

Exchange Format A:

In this Format, you may use one Block for Shadow and another for Freeps, you can also choose the same Block, so Rangers Choke with Corsairs, so FotR Block combined with RotK Block. As for Sites, you can simply mix these from different blocks.

Exchange Format B:

Well, this works a little different to the first one, you may choose to play Movie OR a Block mentioned before. You'll sure ask why choosing a Block instead of Movie, so I'll tell you:
My favorite Ranger/Elven Deck isn't much stronger with the Cards from Towers and RotK, but cards like NSttS, Aragorn, Heir to the White City, Flaming Brand etc. are X-ed in Movie, but if I want to combine it with some sort of Nazzies, it's nice to have cards from 1-10

Just my opinion.

[Smeagollum]

@ WKx5: As far I see it's not important what is the best format, but which format will attract the most players. As far I know it seems that the french prefer movie multipath and the german section prefer Austrian. The Belgians don´t mind. The Brittish I don´t know. And the Dutch will depend on the tournament on the 28th of february± But so far Gil´s pg and mine don´t mind. I myself have a light preference for movieblock multipath with original x-list (plus the proposed errata).
But I don't want only the dutch on the tournament; I want also the french, the brittish, the germans, the belgians, etc at the tournament... So Therefore I need the format which will be accepted by all those players or the format which will give me the most players.

[Smeagollum]

Hi People, well it´s just gonna be a one/day event, but if people would like it it´s possible to do a boosterdraft tournament in the evening.

[Witchkingx5]

We'd like it!

I'm still discussing it with my parents,but it seems as I'll be able to come.

[Smeagollum]

We'd like it!

I'm still discussing it with my parents,but it seems as I'll be able to come.

If you come I'd like to advise you to come one day earlier, because there will be a very big party in the Netherlands (Queensday) and especially in Amsterdam; for instance a free gig from DJ Tiesto on our Musea Square... I think even your parents would like our queensday:)

[Witchkingx5]

I also think so. I'll be 17 years old then, so, perfect age for such events (both tournament and Queensday).

[Smeagollum]

So who will come to the tournament?

[Witchkingx5]

Vell, my prublem is feending a cheep hutel fur my und my mum, vhu elsu vunts tu cume-a, coos' ooff Qooeensdey, iferytheeng is waaay tu ixpenseefe-a... 

[Smeagollum]

Vell, my prublem is feending a cheep hutel fur my und my mum, vhu elsu vunts tu cume-a, coos' ooff Qooeensdey, iferytheeng is waaay tu ixpenseefe-a... 

Did you look for something just outside of amsterdam?

I'll see if I can do something for you.

[Smeagollum]

Here's something.. It's about 20 minutes with train from Amsterdam.. Though train is expensive..

http://www.hostelsclub.com/step015_advsearch.php?lang=en&location=&locationActive=&country=45&city=2991&mese=4&giorno=30&anno=2010&notti=2&guests=2&currency=1&room_type=0&mixed=1&male=1&female=1&maxbeds=0&fac_26=&fac_5=&fac_33=&fac_25=&fac_24=&fac_23=&fac_39=&fac_8=&fac_9=&fac_10=&fac_32=&fac_6=&fac_14=&fac_19=&fac_15=&fac_38=&fac_7=&fac_13=&fac_12=&fac_21=&fac_30=&fac_17=&fac_18=&fac_34=&fac_37=&fac_11=&fac_28=&fac_41=&fac_40=&fac_16=&fac_2=&fac_31=&fac_42=&fac_3=&fac_4=&fac_29=&fac_1=&cat_1=1&cat_2=1&cat_3=1&cat_4=1&cat_5=1&cat_6=1&cat_7=1&cat_8=1&cat_9=1&cat_10=1

I'll ask if you can stay at some of my pg-friends. Have no space myself unfortunately... verry small house

[GarrisonofGondor]

I wish I could come, but I'm in America.

[Witchkingx5]

I'm still discussing it with my parents, but it seems for about 75+ % that I'll come.

[Enola]

I couldn't come this week-end, how was the tournament ?

[Smeagollum]

I'll post a report soon. I think on Wednesday. However I allready can tell you that I was a bit disappointed by the Velgians (Mailed them about 4 times. First time I heard that at least 5 people would come; after that I heard nothing) and in my fellow countrymen (various reasons).

[Witchkingx5]

I also wasn't able to come, I had an official course from the SSB here (klick me!). Sorry for that...

[Smeagollum]

I also wasn't able to come, I had an official course from the SSB here (klick me!). Sorry for that...

You really don't have to anwser to me I'm disappointed in the Belgians and my friends in holland. But no worries there will be another tournament, but then I won't invest about 75 euro's in it.

[Gil-Estel]

Well again, I apologize. I just couldn't make it. So please be disappointed in my absense rather than in me as a person.......

[Smeagollum]

Well again, I apologize. I just couldn't make it. So please be disappointed in my absense rather than in me as a person.......

No worries Heije. Just disappionted that the people I hoped for weren't there to play with. Don't take it to hard 2 people of my pg weren't there as well, while they knew there would be a tournament. Probably just a wrong date. at least you did send an sms. The Belgians didn't reply my later email's.... But that are how things go... So when people didn't anwser my last mail I allready knew what could/would happen. Either way.. we had fun just the same; that report will follow tomorrow.

Anyway just make it up with contributing your thoughts on my virtual Silmarillion set

[Cw0rk]

How did DSODF lost?

[Smeagollum]

How did DSODF lost?

Wrote a variation of kralik's deck: No Gandalf, Smeagol or hobbits. Besides that erwin didn't understand Slaked thirst. Deck was completely focused on Slaked thirst and archery.

[inzilzor]

too far, i wish i could go too.. i want to beat you all..