Preliminary Discussion: Lady Redeemed

[Jimmy_aR]

But to be honest, you wont hurry to find it, right? ;-)...

[Smeagollum]

Take note also that she is banned until a suitable solution is found.

Take note I don't give a .... about it.

Because you don't see ways to encounter her it should be banned. That is really stupid. There is enough reasons not to ban her. If you don't like her then it's your problem and not mine. Find a way to work around her or are you not able to? Think the last. To ban something is the easiest way to something. but hey you vote vvd and that sounds the same.

 Please don't attack others' political beliefs; it is irrelevant to the subject.

[Jimmy_aR]

Nicely said...

[Thranduil]

As you say, RB, Elvents is going to play about 16 events. Those events are all good on their own, or they wouldn't be in the deck. LR not only does all the stuff we've been talking about up till now, but she also turns 16 of your cards (that's a quarter of your deck) into 16 other cards: they can not only do whatever good effect is on their texts, but also use them as Roll of Thunder. That is mad.

Also, Decipher did ban her, just not in all formats. The fact that she was banned basically as soon as she was released surely invalidates your point 3, Smeagollum.

Thran

[Smeagollum]

Can be that an elvendeck runs about 16 events. My point is that most elvendecks would use galdriel rb and i dont remember a rule that there are 2 galdriels can be in play. It's either one or the other. If it's glr that will mean that the deck is less ballanced. And there are alternatives to get rid of her or work around her. I f everybody is using her then loads of people will counter that and peolpe will start to play something else then glr and if that becomes meta then everybody will counter that.

If people play Nazgul with shadow between and orcs then it will be soon enough over with playing glr.
If you play dunlend make sure you control a site and then play that condition that you can assign a minion to an unbound condition. If you play innitiative burdendeck with mordor (without conditions then she won't be affective as well.

So there are enough strategies to work against her. there is no point to ban her, because if everybody would play her then you will see more of those decks. That people start to play her is maybe because lot of people play besiegers, ninja gollum or corsairs. That means you will change decks to and because of that you will see that glr will be less played in the end.

Besides that I think people prefer galadriel rb above glr in an elvendeck. Also note that and maybe you don't know and i cant proof it to you, but, I actually was the first player who started to play ninja gollum in tournaments. Its actually my favourite shadow. dont you think that i hate it to see her in play, because I know i will probably lose. Same counts for if I see RoTEL Elrond. But it's still no reason for me to get her banned.

If you start to ban her how long will it take that you will ban slacked thirst? If something gives npe then its slacked thirst or card discard. Shall we ban archery as well, because you never get to skirmish how npe is that? Know what let we start to ban all the cards which are not nice for the so called good players to make it more comfartable for them to win. I vote to ban every ringbearer (not you Bert, you are just a funny nice guy and not very mean) So far being sarcastic.

Accept also the fact that decipher did decide not to ban her for king and movieblock. And there are good reasons for it why they decided this so. So it doesn't invalidate point 3. Maybe there were other reasons then you can imagine.

But to come towards you so called GLR haters i will think with you to a solution, but that will not be a ban. Read my posts above again for my propasal. If something will cut her down then it will be the errata I propose.

[Smeagollum]

Thank you for the compliment:D

But let's play sometime together and let me use her you will see that there are other ways of playing her.People have seen how I use her. allways not more then 4 to 6 elven events. I can even tell you which ones: 4x elven song and 2 x company of archers.

[Thranduil]

Banning a card because it's an NPE is basically a fundamentally bad reason, I completely agree with you! Also, banning cards which are "good" is also ridiculous. The slippery slope argument is important to remember, but as long as we're careful about this and ban cards for the right reasons (for example, not because they're NPE or tournament-worthy), then it will not be a problem.

But neither of those reasons are why I think LR should be banned. You only ban cards as a last resort—cards that, in retrospect, probably shouldn't have been printed. In my mind, LR falls under this category (so do cards like Frenzy of Arrows and Mordor Fiend and other cards that were indeed completely banned by Decipher). She is far too versatile for any one card, and completely warped the format around her.

Also I would make the point that this is not an irreversible decision. We can try banning her in TLHH formats for a bit, see if that changes any of the metagame or anything. If we like the change, then we can keep the ban (and wait for errata). If actually in retrospect the Rules Team feels the ban isn't necessary, then it can be removed.

Thran

[Kralik]

Smeagollum, LR turns EVERY Elven event into a twilight Roll of Thunder and Company of Archers. Also note that Shadow possessions are SUPPOSED to be very hard to discard. When TTT was released Decipher put out lots of strategy articles. One of them included how the new/upcoming Dunland culture would be using Hides as a possession--oooh! aaah!--and it would be very hard to counter.

[Kenddrick]

What is wrong with Lady Redeemed I don't see what 's wrong?

It's good that her ability cannot be used during skirmish, if not she will be very imbalanced. Also her strength is 3 so she cannot fight.

[Kralik]

Kenddrick, haven't you read the whole thread? People have given many, many answers to that question.

[Gil-Estel]

Seriously Ken, if you don't try to read the topic, than don't react. A lot of good arguments have been mentioned, and some try to ignore those arguments. Let's agree to disagree, but I feel supported by many players of whom I know they rock.
I guess you never play hobbits, since they all have 3 strength, so make poor companions too.

[Kenddrick]

Ok sorry I haven't read it before and now i've read it.

But somehow I still don't understand why Lady Redeemed should be banned. She can discard but that's only during fellowship/regroup so that isn't too bad. That's my opinion though.

[Witchkingx5]

1. Results from Worlds when LR was legal: Each Deck from the Top 16 either played LR or was anti-LR.

2. Elves simply are the most annoying culture in LotR. Their only weakness is the lack of posession removal which LR provides.

3. The possibility to play Stand against darkness 3 or 4 times in a Deck. When you're opponent is playing Sauron, then you have the best anti-card. If not, well they "just" turn into Company of Archers or Roll of Thunder for Zero Twilight.

... (I'm too lazy to list all other arguments too, but those should be enough to ban her.)

[Smeagollum]

Yeah, but that doesnt mean you can ban her. Why not just create a new format in which you can ban her. So the people who want to play with her are still able to. Again cards should not ben banned.

[Gil-Estel]

That is the whole general idea JW, to create a TLHH format. But please stop the 'if you can't handle her, be more creative' argument, cause that doesn't make sense. A whole list has been provides, with valid points, that you don't counter well. If you don't see the difference between Grond and LR, and chanches in getting 1 of the both cards to work, well, than I won't argue anymore, and we will agree to disagree. But I could do the math, eventhough math isn't my strongest point.