Durin's Secret Society of Dear Friends

[Smeagollum]

Smeagollum:

Who really plays Southron Troop? I mean, most people for would rather splash in a Shotgun Enquea for crowd control.

Anyways, a few Slaked Thirsts here, an Aragorn's Bow there...I don't think Southron Troop is a problem.
-wtk

There's only one preparations in his deck so if that one's gone slaked thirsts won't do that much harm. If this deck really is that good as everybody thinks (and I really don't know as I don't encoutered it yet) then it will mean that more people will play it and  that more people will change their shadow and then it might be possible that Southron troop will be played more. And as I understand it he play as much companions as possible to get all his cards out. In that case southron troop is more reliable then Enquea as you can prevent wounds, but you can't prevent troop's discard ability. And it there's a seasoned leader on him then Aragorn's bow won't have a lot of effect as well, though in combo with Legolas greanleaf there should be no problem.

Besides I'm just wandering what the weakness is of this deck.

[ket_the_jet]

You can continuously bring back Preparations with Dear Friends, which you can continuously bring back with Birthday Present.

I have to say, if you don't knock off Sam or Frodo by turn two, then you are in trouble.
-wtk

[Kralik]

There's only one preparations in his deck so if that one's gone slaked thirsts won't do that much harm. If this deck really is that good as everybody thinks (and I really don't know as I don't encoutered it yet) then it will mean that more people will play it and  that more people will change their shadow and then it might be possible that Southron troop will be played more.

Only one Preparations is needed because of Feared Axeman's text. With Slaked Thirsts each move + Archery... Southron Troop won't stick around. I guess High Vantage would be a problem, but at worst, I could always just let Frodo die. Or... haha! discard a companion... like Smeagol. Or anyone besides Greyhame. They just come back anyway.

EDIT: Remember that Seasoned Leader works to my advantage with Eowyn, LoI. And... why won't more people play this deck? I hope it's because they aren't shamelessly copying my idea.

[Smeagollum]

There's only one preparations in his deck so if that one's gone slaked thirsts won't do that much harm. If this deck really is that good as everybody thinks (and I really don't know as I don't encoutered it yet) then it will mean that more people will play it and  that more people will change their shadow and then it might be possible that Southron troop will be played more.

Only one Preparations is needed because of Feared Axeman's text. With Slaked Thirsts each move + Archery... Southron Troop won't stick around. I guess High Vantage would be a problem, but at worst, I could always just let Frodo die. Or... haha! discard a companion... like Smeagol. Or anyone besides Greyhame. They just come back anyway.

EDIT: Remember that Seasoned Leader works to my advantage with Eowyn, LoI. And... why won't more people play this deck? I hope it's because they aren't shamelessly copying my idea.

Haha I saw already one person copying it..

I think you're almost right about southron troop, but if he keeps on table you'll have a problem say if you've got 8 comps on table. Sure you can get Frodo killed and make sam the rb, but it's not so that you've got the option which comps will be discarded. Meaning that Gandalf will be discarded as sam will have big problems to face the troop. And probably they will discard also Gimli. But conclusion is allready that it will be difficult to do, unless you can get Gimli exhausted.

What I don't get is why you're playing atar and not the reflections ring and then add one dwarven ring which gives vitality so that Gimli get an extra vitality?

But as i see it now it's  best way to defeat this deck is to kill either gandalf or legolas. So with two nazguls (plus wound prevention) out with 4 vitality and either 2c Relentless Charge or 2x Too Great and Terrible might be more nasty...
Do you think Dunlend with hides could be tricky for your deck?

[Kralik]

Ah, I misread Southron Troop as the six companion version, and missed that the Shadow player chooses who is discarded. Now that could be a problem. Of course, with careful planning, Eowyn LoI might still save the day.

The Binding Ring is kinda fun, but too dangerous because I start with too many burdens (high starting bid). With the burdens from the first use of Birthday Present added, I can hardly stay below 5 burdens. After I get my fancy cards then burdens are no longer an issue. I do like giving Gimli extra vitality, but it doesn't really seem needed. I guess I could be worried about multiple Hate's in manuever, but with my using Slaked Thirsts as well, I don't know if would realistically get 3 Hate's in a row.

Such a Weight to Carry is nice early game protection, but I switched to ATAR to let me move with NO burdens and add them in Skirmish phase for Smeagol. This is handy because it protects me vs. Easterling Polearm (don't want 2+ burdens in archery phase), Desperate Measures, etc. Remember I want to have 3 burdens by regroup once per triple... can't guarantee that at all with The Binding Ring, and Such A Weight To Carry is a bit dangerous.

As far as the Nazgul scenario... of course it's possible to imagine the perfect killing scenario, but who really builds decks just to kill ONE specific deck? I have about 20 Movie decks and I always switch between them... packing Too Great and Terrible (for example) doesn't seem too practical. There's also the problem that my opponent will rarely have a great Shadow hand (8 perfect cards) because their Freeps will clog them.

I haven't had a chance with Dunland yet, but I anticipate that they would pose a great challenge. Roll of Thunder + a bunch of archery may whittle down Hides, but... could be rough.

[Gil-Estel]

Kralik, I played your deck yesterday and man, it was great. Had a starting hand with Gandalf, Dear Friends, Birthday Present. Discarded my entire deck and began the fellowship building right away. Moved 1, 2, 3, 3-6, 6-9. He played corsairs, but he had no chance. He was very, very impressed by the deck, as am I!

[Smeagollum]

Ah, I misread Southron Troop as the six companion version, and missed that the Shadow player chooses who is discarded. Now that could be a problem. Of course, with careful planning, Eowyn LoI might still save the day.

The Binding Ring is kinda fun, but too dangerous because I start with too many burdens (high starting bid). With the burdens from the first use of Birthday Present added, I can hardly stay below 5 burdens. After I get my fancy cards then burdens are no longer an issue. I do like giving Gimli extra vitality, but it doesn't really seem needed. I guess I could be worried about multiple Hate's in manuever, but with my using Slaked Thirsts as well, I don't know if would realistically get 3 Hate's in a row.

Such a Weight to Carry is nice early game protection, but I switched to ATAR to let me move with NO burdens and add them in Skirmish phase for Smeagol. This is handy because it protects me vs. Easterling Polearm (don't want 2+ burdens in archery phase), Desperate Measures, etc. Remember I want to have 3 burdens by regroup once per triple... can't guarantee that at all with The Binding Ring, and Such A Weight To Carry is a bit dangerous.

As far as the Nazgul scenario... of course it's possible to imagine the perfect killing scenario, but who really builds decks just to kill ONE specific deck? I have about 20 Movie decks and I always switch between them... packing Too Great and Terrible (for example) doesn't seem too practical. There's also the problem that my opponent will rarely have a great Shadow hand (8 perfect cards) because their Freeps will clog them.

I haven't had a chance with Dunland yet, but I anticipate that they would pose a great challenge. Roll of Thunder + a bunch of archery may whittle down Hides, but... could be rough.

Well as soon as I am out of hospital and recovered and somebody gives me a good explaination in dutch how to use gccg then I volunteer testing. I always like this kind of decks, but also curious about it's weakneses and there is an anwser to everithing rigt? Even if it's a deck which nobody would play 

As you see Heije copied it. Didn't saw the match, but heard it was incredible and then my curiousity was woken So in the end Heije is quilty about my curiousity hahaha Just kidding Heije!

[Smeagollum]

Ah, I misread Southron Troop as the six companion version, and missed that the Shadow player chooses who is discarded. Now that could be a problem. Of course, with careful planning, Eowyn LoI might still save the day.

By the way.. have a nice story about the southron commander you mentioned. It was at a TT-block tournament in amsterdam 2 days before the european championship (on the first of july.. I remember becuase my birthday is at the third) I played a fantastic ringbound companion fellowship and then I met a Spanish guy.. and he played actually nothing spectaculair. Had no problems and wasn't afraid for enquea, because it was a tt-block so I played all the comps I encountered in my hand.. and then site 7 came with no special skirmish abilities or events and the Southron Commander.. Oh boy what a win he had... Could not discard unbound companions as I only had Ringbound and I couldn't pump Frodo with either Atar or use an event so he should tripple me.... and Sam was not there yet as well:( I was so toasted.

[Kralik]

Kralik, I played your deck yesterday and man, it was great. Had a starting hand with Gandalf, Dear Friends, Birthday Present. Discarded my entire deck and began the fellowship building right away. Moved 1, 2, 3, 3-6, 6-9. He played corsairs, but he had no chance. He was very, very impressed by the deck, as am I!

Great to hear it! It seems like luck is often on my side with the Birthday Present draw... either on site 1 or site 2, usually. Actually, odds are quite good that you'll get either Birthday Present or Dear Friends. This deck is one of very few of my decks that can actually stand up to corsairs... and well at that! No Aragorn's Bow is a pity, but Castamir and co. are my dear, dear friends.

Smeagollum - yikes! I bet your opponent had Southron Commander for a while and was just biding his time... and Ringbound Rangers is a deck style that mostly needs 6+ comps. Curse Them might help, but not at Cavern Entrance...  

Other random ideas for Durin's deck:
-Swap Frodo for Courteous Halfling. Not sure if it's a good idea since it means you need to get Gandalf early and keep him alive. Would be helpful vs. certain decks though... and Legolas with the Frodo signet can substitute for Smeagol if you decide you don't need him for a turn (Play Gandalf and Legolas together, bring Smeagol back next turn).
-Add Pippin WoBaS for a backup hobbit in case Frodo dies. He can always be taken to hand and discarded once you reach the Rule of 9 limit.
-And something I already do: Depending on the matchup, I usually add 3 threats at site 3 just to activate Gimli's Battle Axe, Trusted Weapon.

What do you all think of Ever My Heart Rises instead of Beneath the Mountains?

Pros:
-Better Freeps draws (and better chances for a site 1 Birthday Present)
-Better control with deck discarding

Cons:
-Lots of twilight for site 1!
-Gimli is weak without his axe and easy to overwhelm.

Hmm... 

[Smeagollum]

Mr K.

Think Frodo, Master of the Precious would be a better choise and i would go for emhr. It's just 2 twilight more and it will make your deck faster. Would take a different axe though. The one from 2nd block.

[Kralik]

With Ever My Heart Rises, I am concerned about something like:

Ever My Heart Rises - Twilight.
Other Random Freeps cards - Twilight (Doesn't matter, but let's assume no spare companions)
Moving to Site: for companions, or more for site

Total:

In the situation where my opponents drops down a single minion like Castamir, I'm hosed. Gimli is 6, so all companions could be overwhelmed except perhaps Smeagol, but he can only do his discarding trick once. Fierce kills someone...

[Smeagollum]

With Ever My Heart Rises, I am concerned about something like:

Ever My Heart Rises - Twilight.
Other Random Freeps cards - Twilight (Doesn't matter, but let's assume no spare companions)
Moving to Site: for companions, or more for site

Total:

In the situation where my opponents drops down a single minion like Castamir, I'm hosed. Gimli is 6, so all companions could be overwhelmed except perhaps Smeagol, but he can only do his discarding trick once. Fierce kills someone...

See what you mean.. that would hurt indeed.

But besides that I think I found the anwser to your riddle:

You mentioned that you were curious about beasterlings.. well Beasterlings won't hurt you, because you'll remove burdens plenty. So I said that easterlings won't hurt you, but there I am wrong; I think Easterlings can hurt you big time, more then Castamir could do. The only thing they need to do is get around your archery... Hello Polearm

What I think will cripple your fellowship is to take away your healing and the best way to do so is by removing burdens instead of adding them. For instance:

Easterling Veteran
Easterling Assailant
Easterling Veteran

Combine it with:

Easterling Attacker
Easterling Blademaster
Easterling Ransacker
Easterling Berserker

Also helping would be Gollum Dark as darkness so you can make Fierce in Despair optional or something like Red Wrath.

Ofcourse 2x Ships of Great Draught are needed as well. But basic idea is get around your archery get to skirmish and kill of one of your companions in the skirmish, by making it damage plus x or using Red Wrath.

Something which also could hurt is a combo of mordor minions with say 4x Desperate Measures plus condition removal. But that one would be more difficult.

What do you think?

[Not a Zombie]

high vantage could hurt

[legolas3333]

With Ever My Heart Rises, I am concerned about something like:

Ever My Heart Rises - Twilight.
Other Random Freeps cards - Twilight (Doesn't matter, but let's assume no spare companions)
Moving to Site: for companions, or more for site

Total:

In the situation where my opponents drops down a single minion like Castamir, I'm hosed. Gimli is 6, so all companions could be overwhelmed except perhaps Smeagol, but he can only do his discarding trick once. Fierce kills someone...

See what you mean.. that would hurt indeed.

But besides that I think I found the anwser to your riddle:

You mentioned that you were curious about beasterlings.. well Beasterlings won't hurt you, because you'll remove burdens plenty. So I said that easterlings won't hurt you, but there I am wrong; I think Easterlings can hurt you big time, more then Castamir could do. The only thing they need to do is get around your archery... Hello Polearm

What I think will cripple your fellowship is to take away your healing and the best way to do so is by removing burdens instead of adding them. For instance:

Easterling Veteran
Easterling Assailant
Easterling Veteran

Combine it with:

Easterling Attacker
Easterling Blademaster
Easterling Ransacker
Easterling Berserker

Also helping would be Gollum Dark as darkness so you can make Fierce in Despair optional or something like Red Wrath.

Ofcourse 2x Ships of Great Draught are needed as well. But basic idea is get around your archery get to skirmish and kill of one of your companions in the skirmish, by making it damage plus x or using Red Wrath.

Something which also could hurt is a combo of mordor minions with say 4x Desperate Measures plus condition removal. But that one would be more difficult.

What do you think?

you would need more that 30 twilight to pull this off, probably 35 with high vantage to prevent the directed wounding and gollum, DaD to add twilight, and you realize that removing burdens with gollum, DaD let's him heal with TSC?

[Kralik]

L3333, TSC activates only when Freeps removes burdens. Also, I don't think Smeagollum was proposing ALL of those minions at once, just a sampling. High Vantage doesn't work for Easterlings anyway.

sweet, hope for High Vantage lies in Eowyn LoI... best chance anyway. Or Gorn takes them all... yaaar! For Froooooodooooooo!

Smeagollum, I did actually play against Heije's Easterlings with the works: Small Hope, Easterling Captain, Easterling Polearm, etc. Somehow (surprisingly to me but not to him) I made it just fine. Deep in Thought to take out Small Hope, Roll of Thunder to take out Easterling Polearm, and general luck I suppose. That being said...

I move without any burdens. For the Easterling examples you used above, how were you planning on adding burdens? Small Hope? And, if you do add burdens, how many Easterlings do you expect to be shielded by Easterling Polearm each turn? Any that are not are dead before Skirmish. Easterling Veteran with wounds would be a nice target for Eowyn: if you remove burdens, your Easterling Polearm advantage is lost.

Gorgoroth Stormer + Desperate Measures was why I was wondering about Courteous Halfling. On a side note, because of the risk in early twilight, I'm thinking of dropping Gimli's fancy axe for plain-ol' Dwarven Axe.