Playing a card as a card effect

[MarcinS]

Hello, I have to say I'm confused and don't really understand the following part of Comprehensive rules (maybe it's just a matter of language barrier), so please explain it to me, especially the "Exception" part:
"If you meet all the requirements and pay all the costs for playing a card, you may play that card even if the card will have no effect. Exception: If you perform an action that has playing a card from hand or discard pile as part of its effect, you must play that card. This exception applies to all kinds of actions and all the different ways you can play a card (except playing a card directly from your draw deck)."

So if I have a Galadriel from FotR in play.
1. Can I exert her to use her ability, even if I have no Elf in hand?
2. If I have an Elf in hand and I've used her ability, do I have to play the Elf, or can I just choose to change my mind?

Same deal with Prancing Pony.
3. Can I add a burden if I have no Aragorn in deck?
4. Can I add a burden and not play Aragorn from deck, even if I have one there?
5. Can I add a burden if I already have Aragorn in play (uniqueness) ?

Thanks in advance!

[hsiale]

Galadriel: no and no, you play the Elf from hand (so not from draw deck), so the exception holds, you must be able to play an Elf and you must play that Elf.

Prancing Pony
1. Yes, you can even corrupt yourself that way
2. Generally no, because, even when action tries to play Aragorn from deck (so exception does not hold), you need to do as much as you can. And usually you can play Aragorn Only situation I can think about is already having another copy of Aragorn in play.
3. Yes (which is the example I gave above). Uniqueness makes it impossible to you to play Aragorn. But, as the action tries to play him from deck, the exception does not hold and you can do the action even when you can't perform the effect.

And if it's language barrier (sorry for some English words, I never played LotR in Polish):

Kazda akcja w grze ma koszty i efekty. Zeby wykonac akcje, musisz byc w stanie zaplacic wszystkie koszty. Jak juz te koszty zaplacisz, mozesz wykonac efekty. Czasem jest ich wiele i niektóre jestes w stanie wykonac, inne nie (albo nawet zadnych nie jestes w stanie wykonac). Wtedy, w wiekszosci sytuacji, wykonujesz tyle efektu, ile sie da. Jest jeden wyjatek: jesli wsród efektów jest zagranie karty skad inad niz z draw decku, musisz byc w stanie ten efekt wykonac. I w zwiazku z tym musisz go wykonac (bo zawsze wykonujesz tyle, ile sie da, nie mozesz zrezygnowac). Dlatego nie mozesz uzywac (placic kosztu) Galadriel, LoL nie majac w reku elfa, którego da sie zagrac (po czym musisz tego elfa zagrac), nie mozesz pozbywac sie niepotrzebnych kart przy uzyciu They Are Coming jesli w discardzie nie masz orka, którego da sie zagrac, nie mozesz uzyc Hobbiton Woods jesli twoj drugi site juz lezy na stole, ale mozesz uzywac Prancing Pony do woli (oczywiscie, jesli w draw decku masz Aragorna, a na stole nie, zagrac go musisz), mozesz tez n.p. grac Simbelmyne nie majac nic w draw decku - bo to ograniczenie dotyczy kart granych z wszystkich miejsc oprócz draw decku. Mam nadzieje ze pomoglem

[MarcinS]

Well, my problem is with the wording of the exception:
"If you perform an action that has playing a card from hand or discard pile as part of its effect, you must play that card."

This wording, in my understanding, does not imply that you have to BE ABLE to play the card to perform the action, just that if you can play the card - you have to.

If being able to play the card as part of the effect of the performed action would be a requirement to be able to perform the action, the exception would (probably) be worded as follows.
"If you perform an action that has playing a card from hand or discard pile as part of its effect, you must be able to play that card to perform the action."

Based on the understanding of the rules, as described above, the answers for me - would be:
1. Yes.
2. No.
3. Yes.
4. Yes.
5. Yes.

[hsiale]

If this was the case, there would be no need for the exception at all. Because standard rules, valid for all kinds of actions, already make you perform as much of the effects as you can (for example, if you exert Legolas, Greenleaf and there is an opponent's minion on the table that can take wounds, you must wound a minion, you can't choose not to do it) - you can't choose some of the effect and omit the others, you can (and must) omit only those, that, for various reasons, you can't perform. The exception says that in case of the effect being playing a card (from any place other than draw deck) you have even less freedom - you have to be able to perform that particular effect, if you can't, you are not allowed to perform the action (for example, you can't use Treebeard, KotW only to destroy opponent's conditions, you need to have a discarded condition that you can play).

[juanjo]

Each card/ability has a cost and an effect. If you can pay all the costs of a card/ability, these take effect. If not, card/ability isn't played.
Then, you MUST do as much of the effects as you can: If you can't do the first specific effect, you don't do it; but if you can, you must do it. Then, if you can't perform the second effect, you don't do it...

1.- Yes, you can pay the cost (exerting Galadriel). Then, you should play an elf from hand if possible (this is part of the effect, not the cost). As you don't have it, you don't play it.
2.- You have played the cost (exerting Galadriel). Then, you should play an elf from hand if possible (effect). No option here as stated before: If you have an elf, you must play it. So you must play your elf from hand.

3.- Add a burden (cost) to play Aragorn from your draw deck (effect). You add the burden (cost). Then, you try to play an Aragorn from deck. As you don't have it, you don't play it.
4.- You add the burden (cost). Then, you try to play Aragorn from the draw deck.  If you can play it "... you must play that card" as long as it is possible to play it.
5.- You add the burden (cost). Then, you try to play Aragorn. As you can't, you don't.

Hope it helps.

[Elessar's Socks]

"If you meet all the requirements and pay all the costs for playing a card, you may play that card even if the card will have no effect. Exception: If you perform an action that has playing a card from hand or discard pile as part of its effect, you must play that card. This exception applies to all kinds of actions and all the different ways you can play a card (except playing a card directly from your draw deck)."

I think the situations you mentioned are covered by other rules (or aren't prevented by a rule):

So if I have a Galadriel from FotR in play.
1. Can I exert her to use her ability, even if I have no Elf in hand?

No - [url=http://lotrtcgwiki.com/forums/index.php/topic,7480.msg73514.html#msg73514]EDIT[/b]b]EDIT[/b[/url] "If you perform an action that has playing a card from your hand or discard pile as part of its effect, you must play that card." ("effect")

2. If I have an Elf in hand and I've used her ability, do I have to play the Elf, or can I just choose to change my mind?

You have to play the Elf - "If the effect of a card or special ability requires you to perform an action and you cannot, you must perform as much as you can and ignore the rest." ("effect")

(Technically the rule is covering an action you can't fully perform, but we apply the same to an action you *can* fully perform - you must perform as much as you can.)

Same deal with Prancing Pony.
3. Can I add a burden if I have no Aragorn in deck?

Yes - No rule in general stops costs from being paid if the action can't be fully performed; the rule quoted in (2) kind of touches on that.

4. Can I add a burden and not play Aragorn from deck, even if I have one there?

Yes - "There is no penalty if you don't find (or choose not to play) a card you are looking for in your draw deck." ("draw deck")

5. Can I add a burden if I already have Aragorn in play (uniqueness) ?

Yes - Same reason as (3).

[MarcinS]

Thanks Elessar's Socks, that clears everything up for good. I'll make the necessary changes in the game to follow the rules you've laid down.

Maybe this topic should be stickied. It seems it's not the first time people ask about stuff like that.