the new president

[MR. Lurtzy]

@ Gil-Estel (sorry, computer won't let me quote)- Since 9/11, there were many different planned attacks by terrorists, but all were stopped before they were able to happen. I think that that is a great feat, especially in this time of war. To say that privacy was too high of a cost- if Bush didn't do what he had to, there would have been many more lives lost. Because the media painted the picture of a terrible president in our minds, people seem unable to believe that anything that he has done was actually good. Doing what was right over what was politically smart was a very noble thing, but Bush will never get credit for it.

[Elrohir]

Well, I think bush did not enough for the environment. I hope the next one will act immediately, otherwise Global Warming will overwhelm us all soon.

[sickofpalantirs]

good to know Turin, actually I remember reading that polar ice was actually increasing in Antarctica, just dropping in the arctic.

I get the increase in snowfall, what doesn't meld in my mind is the record low temperatures.

[Gil-Estel]

Again, global warming is not about rising temperatures everywhere, it is about shifting weather, and other extremes. Heavy rainfall, freezing colds, enormous heats etc etc.

[King89]

Again, global warming is not about rising temperatures everywhere, it is about shifting weather, and other extremes. Heavy rainfall, freezing colds, enormous heats etc etc.

sorry, but you're only 50% right. the effects you have described (hifting weather, heavy rainfall...) are the results of the rising temperature. for example the melting of the polar icecaps --> heavy rainfall...


edit: SOMEONE SHOULD OPEN A NEW TREAD 

[sickofpalantirs]

awe I think I see now.  that makes more sense.

[Gil-Estel]

I never said that Global Warming is only about those effects, it is the result of rising temperatures at certain places. Not everywhere it will get warmer, but especially at those places where it will get warmer, the effects are greater. But please keep in mind that this whole theory about global warming is widely debated by scientists around the world. And there isn't a consensus about the cause of it, and neither about the effects. Is it naturally, is it human caused, is it a combination of both. We're talking about things we can't fully grasp.
The werid thing is that certain effects are caused by good things. For example, due to cleaner air in Europe in the past 30-35 years there is an incredible decrease of fog, which leads to higher temperatures.
What can we say? Polution is a bad thing, no matter what. We need to focus on clean ways of doing the things we've always done. We don't need to be overdramatic about the future for the simple reason we don't know. We need to be cautious, and again, to keep on topic, it is great to see Obama picking up the challenge to look at least in to it.

[Gate Troll]

Okay, Hitler didn't belong in this thread and neither does Global warming.

Now, on to the subject, and EL's questions:

GT, what specifically do you not like about Obama? I mean, we can go back and forth with Hitler-arguments, I'm sure, but talk policy.

Okay. Here goes. This is the list of reasons I disagree with Obama.

#1: Big Government
Obama loves big government and all the headaches that come with it.
He wants more taxes, more restrictions put upon middle class and
more control of people's lives.

#2: Socialism
Obama plans to spread the wealth around via taxes that would hit hard
on the ordinary middle-class guy. He plans to pay the lower classes for the
simple reason that they have less money. The treasury is too far in debt
already, so this is all going to come out of the wallets of hard-working men and women.

#3: Plans for the economy
We're in the middle of a recession, right? So why does Obama think that spending
more money will somehow clean everything up? Its like he's saying:
"Okay guys, lets sling another trillions dollars of tax money at this thing and hope
that it fixes everything!"

#4: Infringement of Rights
The guy doesn't give a d--- for the Bill of Rights. He wants to impose all sorts of
ludicrous laws and restrictions on gun owners that would inhibit the law-abiding
person, not the criminal. He also wants to reimpose the so called
'Fairness Doctrine', a law that infringes on our right of free speech.

#5: Support of Abortion
Last Sunday marked the 35th anniversary of Roe vs. Wade, and the 35th anniversary of
one of our greatest failures as a nation. For the last 35 years countless millions of
unborn babies have been murdered for the sole reason that they were 'inconvenient.'
For the last 35 years doctors, who have taken the Hippocratic oath and sworn to protect,
save, and uphold life have murdered countless. Now Obama has issued an executive order
to make more abortions possible by using your tax money.

No wonder I'm not feeling the magic of Obama...
Now, on what you said next:

And yes, I'm aware that what he claims he's going to do isn't what he's gonna do %100. But you can't hate a person because he could be a liar. That's irrational.

And mean.

I don't hate him because he could be a liar, in fact I don't hate him at all.
The man truly is a liar though. I mean come on, the guy contradicts himself
every week, first he says that 'only government can truly solve the crisis' and then
he says that 'only the workers of America can solve the crisis and all the politicians
can do is give them a favorable climate in which to work'. Sounds like lies to me.

Are you religious at all, GT? It's off topic but I'm wondering. You seem to have beef with misplaced faith.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'religious'. I am a Christian, and since I place my faith in Christ I
don't believe my faith is in any way misplaced. I have another question for you:
In what way is my faith misplaced?

[AgentDrake]

[INSERT INTERRUPTION]

Hey guys. Just a friendly reminder not to let this spiral out of control. I haven't read the last page or so, but it doesn't look like it's reached that point yet, I'm just throwing this out there as a preemtive thing. We're all friends here. Maybe friends who have fundamental differences, but friends nonetheless.
We don't want any hostility here. Just remember that everyone else is arguing their point of view because they honestly want the best for their nation and the world, not because they want to drive the US or Britain, the Netherlands, or the entire world, et cetera into the dirt.

Okay, back to your arguing.

[/INTERRUPTION]

[Elf_Lvr]

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'religious'. I am a Christian, and since I place my faith in Christ I
don't believe my faith is in any way misplaced. I have another question for you:
In what way is my faith misplaced?

I'm not saying any sort of religious faith is misplaced - you misunderstand me. I'm a Christian, too. I was just thinking that the way you talk about people's "faith" in Obama is interesting, when compared to how some people talk about God.

Like I said, it was off-topic.

[Gil-Estel]

The sad thing is GT, that not spending money is not the answer. It is like an engine. When the oillevel is low, you must add new oil otherwise the engine will stall. And I also wonder, you say he wants to raise taxes, but this night, at least for me it was night, his plan was accepted which also included the lowering of the taxes of the middle class. And added to that, why do people always combine hard working with having more? People who have less, don't work less hard. That is the case with some, but not with all.
And then again: saying one thing and doing the other isn't it the way of politicians? Just kidding, but those things happen to all of us, and doesn't nessecarelly mean you're a liar, maybe you're just facing the impossibility of something you really wanted.
Also, what I must say, is that opposing is the easiest thing there is. As we say in Holland: if you want to beat a dog, a stick is easily found. Rather think constructive, instead of opposing. It is good to be critical, but he, you have to deal with this guy for some time, than better make it work. It starts with some faith, not that he will succeed, but that he is willing to succeed, for the better of the US, and maybe, for the better of the world. It is all about dealing with any given situation, try to make the best of it!

[Anonymous Prodigy]

So this pretty much boils down to...

A. The European body of the forum is mostly pro-Obama.
B. The North American body of the forum is mostly anti-Obama.
C. We knew both of these things before this thread was even started.

Which means.... this is all GE's fault!

[Olorin]

Let's tar and feather GE! ;-)

[sickofpalantirs]

lol...its more like
A. Europeans like obama...I found this generally true...even with my favorite Christian Author, Englishman Chris walley.  Go to his blog, he has some good reasons.
http://chriswalley.blogspot.com/
first post and last post talk about obama.

b.  Most Americans here hate obama.
C. Some of us like obama.
D.  Others are just confused.

[MR. Lurtzy]

I don't want Obama to succeed, I want him to do what's right.