The Way Into Mordor - Isengard (12/31: Token Machine Stuff)

[lem0nhead]

At The Fore
Condition • Support Area
Each time you play an mount or Warg, you may exert an minion to add an token here.
Shadow: Remove X tokens from here to play an minion; its twilight cost is -X (limit -4). Discard this condition.
"But before them, swift and silent, went several troops of the dreaded wolfriders."

Could cost 0 and i dont think you need to discard it either.

In Disarray
Event • Response
If a Free Peoples event is played or a special ability is used during a skirmish involving a mounted or minion, cancel it.
"He could not reach Grimbold, though he...had been about to come to his aid when attacked by the wolfriders."

Fine.

The title of your post at the moment is very amusing. 

[DáinIronfoot]

Alright, I think we're pretty much done with wolfriders, so I want to transition back to Helm's Deep Uruks. Today's cards form a very nice bridge between the two.

It Is Over
Event • Skirmish
Make a companion skirmishing an minion strength -1 for each card in the dead pile.
"‘So much death. What can Men do against such reckless hate?'"

Nice and simple. Should it be instead?

•Lament of the Fallen
Condition • Support Area
Each time a companion of a culture is killed, you may exert an minion to exert a companion of that same culture X times, where X is the number of characters of that culture in the dead pile.
"‘Out of a grey country darkness lies / And all paths are drowned deep in shadow....'"

Too confusing? Let me know if you have a better wording suggestion.

The lore, by the way, is the translation of "Haldir's Lament", sung in Elvish as Haldir falls in the Two Towers film.

•How Did It Come To This?
Condition • Support Area
When you play this condition, add an token here for each character in the dead pile.
Regroup: Discard 2 minions and remove X tokens to place a companion with strength X in the dead pile.
"‘The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. / Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning, / Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?'"

Bwahaha!

[lem0nhead]

It Is Over
Event • Skirmish
Make a companion skirmishing an minion strength -1 for each card in the dead pile.
"‘So much death. What can Men do against such reckless hate?'"

No, leave it as is.

•Lament of the Fallen
Condition • Support Area
Each time a companion of a culture is killed, you may exert an minion to exert a companion of that same culture X times, where X is the number of characters of that culture in the dead pile.
"‘Out of a grey country darkness lies / And all paths are drowned deep in shadow....'"

You can cut the first "of a culture" and change "that same culture" to "the same culture". And i also thing its very nasty if used correctly, once the bodies start piling up though this is gonna add to them REAL fast. Fair enough idea though.

•How Did It Come To This?
Condition • Support Area
When you play this condition, add an token here for each character in the dead pile.
Regroup: Discard 2 minions and remove X tokens to kill a companion with strength X.
"‘The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. / Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning, / Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?'"

Hmmm im not sure you should ever phrase it kill. Place in dead pile maybe, but even though you have clearly designed it like this for a reason im not sure it should be done.

[sickofpalantirs]

Alright, I think we're pretty much done with wolfriders, so I want to transition back to Helm's Deep Uruks. Today's cards form a very nice bridge between the two.

It Is Over
Event • Skirmish
Make a companion skirmishing an minion strength -1 for each card in the dead pile.
"‘So much death. What can Men do against such reckless hate?'"

Nice and simple. Should it be instead?
yes.

•Lament of the Fallen
Condition • Support Area
Each time a companion of a culture is killed, you may exert an minion to exert a companion of that same culture X times, where X is the number of characters of that culture in the dead pile.
"‘Out of a grey country darkness lies / And all paths are drowned deep in shadow....'"
cut cost to 1


•How Did It Come To This?
Condition • Support Area
When you play this condition, add an token here for each character in the dead pile.
Regroup: Discard 2 minions and remove X tokens to place a companion with strength X in the dead pile.
"‘The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. / Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning, / Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?'"

fine.

[Thranduil]

It Is Over
Event • Skirmish
Make a companion skirmishing an minion strength -1 for each card in the dead pile.
"‘So much death. What can Men do against such reckless hate?'"

I think this card is fine as is.

•Lament of the Fallen
Condition • Support Area
Each time a companion of a culture is killed, you may exert an minion to exert a companion of that same culture X times, where X is the number of characters of that culture in the dead pile.
"‘Out of a grey country darkness lies / And all paths are drowned deep in shadow....'"

I think it's cool. There should be an card called "Haldir's Lament" as well.

•How Did It Come To This?
Condition • Support Area
When you play this condition, add an token here for each character in the dead pile.
Regroup: Discard 2 minions and remove X tokens to place a companion with strength X in the dead pile.
"‘The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. / Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning, / Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?'"

Hilarious! I think the condition should discard itself, but this card is cool - it's like a bomb which you have to work your way to like Devilry of Orthanc.

Thranduil

[DáinIronfoot]

Ironically, today's cards are rather similiar to Menace's Grey Company cards in that they target specific FP races. I like his much better, but hopefully these are useful enough in their own right. Enjoy!

Orthanc Skirmisher
Minion • Uruk-hai
Strength: 7
Vitality: 2
Site: 5
Damage +1. To play, spot an Uruk-hai.
Each Elf and Dwarf skirmishing this minion is strength -2.
Even many long-time warriors of Middle-earth were at a disadvantage against Saruman's Uruk-hai, having had little contact with them.

Orthanc Slaughterer
Minion • Uruk-hai
Strength: 7
Vitality: 2
Site: 5
Damage +1. To play, spot an Uruk-hai.
Each Man skirmishing this minion is strength -2.
Even the bravest and heartiest men of Rohan quickly grew to fear Saruman's Uruk-hai warriors as they rampaged through the Riddermark.

[Thranduil]

I mean, I wouldn't use them in a deck, but they're fine.

Thranduil

[sickofpalantirs]

I think you could safely cut each to 2.

[FM]

Yeah, they'd be fine at 2.

[Thranduil]

Yeah, they'd be fine at 2.

No, I don't agree. Orthanc Warrior is fine at - another card I wouldn't use in a deck, but is inherently balanced the way it is.

Thranduil

[FM]

Why so? You said yourself, you wouldn't use it a deck, so it pretty much sucks (and I think it does). Just because D DOES make minions that suck, it doesn't mean they must be taken as a cap to OTHER minions. It's really hard to weigh cards against vanilla minions. For a MtG-related comparison, take a look at Tarmogoyf and Grizzly Bears. Should Wizards use the Bears as a cap to making ceatures?!?

[lem0nhead]

Think theyre both ok at 2 cos its a risk using them if not facing the right deck.

[Thranduil]

Why so? You said yourself, you wouldn't use it a deck, so it pretty much sucks (and I think it does). Just because D DOES make minions that suck, it doesn't mean they must be taken as a cap to OTHER minions. It's really hard to weigh cards against vanilla minions. For a MtG-related comparison, take a look at Tarmogoyf and Grizzly Bears. Should Wizards use the Bears as a cap to making ceatures?!?

Obviously there is a power curve, but also looking at MTG there are a lot of cards that have the appropriate costs but are not construction worthy. These guys are like that.

Though to be honest, I don't really care either way, and I wouldn't use them if they cost either.

Thranduil

[FM]

But some might, you see. This way, you give some sort of incentive for them in playing the guys. Orthanc Warrior had its time, so now he should step aside for the new guys to have some love. And costing 3, they wouldn't get any.

[DáinIronfoot]

Funny how the simplest cards sometimes cause the biggest discussion.

Okay, a fair compromise: I lowered their costs to , but added a very simple (and not even culturally enforced!) spotting requirement to compensate. That should make them more viable than if they were while keeping them from completely overshadowing Orthanc Warrior. So...how is that?