Archery total and placing wounds

[TheJord]

I wanted to clarify a rule question that came up with NK and I earlier on. The question was how wounds are placed from the archery totals, whether it is simultaneously or not.

I quote this direct from the Black Rider starter Rulebook.

The Free Peoples player assigns wounds to his or her companions, one at a time, equal to the minion archery total. The Shadow player then assigns wounds to his or her minions, one at a time, equal to the fellowship archery total.

The archery totals are calculated after all actions have been completed. As I understand it, these totals do not change, even if an archer companion/ally is killed by archery fire, before the fellowship archery has been resolved. This means, in essence, the result is simultaneous, but the rules are clear on the method of performing it.

[DáinIronfoot]

As you said, wounds are assigned one at a time, yes. So if you have a card that does something each time a companion is wounded, you can do it over and over each time you one of those archery wounds is placed on a companion (since they are NOT all assigned simultaniously).

As far as killing off an archer, though...VERY good question. I would think, logically, that any FP archer killed before the Shadow assigns the fellowshp archery total wounds would NOT count towards the fellowship archery total. So if Legolas bit it when you took all the Shadow archery, his arrow would never fly, and the fellowship archery total would be reduced BEFORE the Shadow player(S) has to assign any of it. But I confess I don't know the definitive answer. I could see the argument for the other side too, in that the FP arrows could be considered already "in the air" before the Shadow arrows hit, and thus Legolas' archery would still count.

Hmmm. Anyone know the actual answer? :hey:

[NappyKorn]

From what a ruling genius explained to me arrows are in the air at the same time for the final stage of the archery phase. So even if a companion is killed during regular archery fire his arrows have already been released. LOtR doesn't work to much on normal logic LOL. If you think about if there is no archery total to increase (no archery minions or companions in play) how card card add arrows to that which doesn't exist. Of course it does but you can't think with normal logic in this game just be the rules that are laid out.

BTW the ruling genius I speak of is Bib

[DáinIronfoot]

BTW the ruling genius I speak of is Bib

Tell him to get his butt in here! I'll even make him a mod for this forum again. We NEED Bib!

[NappyKorn]

BTW the ruling genius I speak of is Bib

Tell him to get his butt in here! I'll even make him a mod for this forum again. We NEED Bib!

Been trying my friend he is a hard man to get a reply out of. Been trying since TLHH opened up shop . This time I increase the offer by stating he will get mod status. Maybe with 2 of us harassing him and the thought of being a mod again he will finally break and join  :hey:.

[DáinIronfoot]

Let's hope so. Jord and ES are great, but a gameplay forum without Bib just ain't right!

[CarpeGuitarrem]

The archery totals are calculated after all actions have been completed. As I understand it, these totals do not change, even if an archer companion/ally is killed by archery fire, before the fellowship archery has been resolved. This means, in essence, the result is simultaneous, but the rules are clear on the method of performing it.

It's not simultaneous in terms of game mechanics, but logically it is simultaneous. In LOTR, though, mechanics trump logic. It's a compromise between real-time combat and turn-based combat.

So yes, the totals do not change after their initial calculation, even if an archer is killed.

[Elessar's Socks]

Let's hope so. Jord and ES are great, but a gameplay forum without Bib just ain't right!

Haha, yeah, Bib also has the authority to settle anything ambiguous (e.g. the "For each Ent or each unbound Hobbit, the twilight cost is -1" business).

Anyway, fanhq was down for a while the other day. That got me wondering if we should host the rulebooks and CRDs here. In any case I'm saving them to my hard drive!

[SomeRandomDude]

This is how it happens.

Minion archery total and Fellowship archery total calculated.
Fellowship eats minion archery.
Minions eat fellowship archery.
So, the archery total of the fellowship won't change even if some of your archers bite the dust.

[bibfortuna25]

If some of the archers on one side are killed after the archery total is calculated, the archery totals will remain the same.

[SomeRandomDude]

w00t Bib's back! (we need that dancing smiley back...)

[smallman]

My last opponent was confused by this thread when I used gorns bow to kill Archer of Harad to reduce the archery total by 2.  This thread only relates to the final simultaneous archery fire.  This is the correct full Archery phase procedure:

1.  If there are no minions in play at the start of the archery phase, skip straight to the regroup phase.

2.  Both players can alternate start of archery phase actions beginning with freeps.

3.  Both players can now do normal archery phase actions beginning with freeps.

4.  Now that all actions are done the archery totals are calculated, and DO NOT include any archers that WERE in play but have been removed by recent actions, and cant be changed anymore regardless of who might die in the upcoming simultaneous fire.

5. The Free Peoples player assigns wounds to his or her companions, one at a time, equal to the minion archery total. The Shadow player then assigns wounds to his or her minions, one at a time, equal to the fellowship archery total.

[TheJord]

Your opponent should not have been confused, especially as in my first post I said "The archery totals are calculated after all actions have been completed". How this is confusing I do not know!