Mumak Commander and *Mumak Commander, GotS

[OneFathom]

Just an odd question I'm posing regarding the RotK Mumak Commander and the Hunters Mumak Commander, Giant Among the Swertings.

Mumak Commander, Giant Among the Swertings says exert Mumak Commander twice to exert a companion twice.  If you had both out, which you can because the RotK version is non-unique, could you use exert him twice to exert a companion twice even though that's not in his individual text?  My guess is you probably can't, but just curious.  Any guesses? 

OF

[SomeRandomDude]

Hm...can you really have both out? If so, can you say...Seasoned Leader? That would rock.

[TheJord]

Mumak Commander, GatS is unique, and as you cant have different copies of companions with different subtitles, then you cant have both of these out.

Sorry to ruin the idea 

[FM]

And even if you could, whenever a card refers to itself by name, it means that specific object, so the ability of a Mumak Commander could only be used to exert that specific Mumak Commander. Not sure I'm making myself clear enough...

[TheJord]

Well this situation would never occur as gametext only refers to itself by name when it is unique, and therefore wouldnt ever provide the opportunity to activate an ability that is not its own.

[SomeRandomDude]

He's right in MtG, but out of it with LotR. Ignore him.

(just kidding)

TJ's point is the best, so I go with it.

[OneFathom]

To all-thanks for the quick response.  Glad we could put that one to rest.

[Thranduil]

I'm not sure that you can't play 7R152 then play 15R86. This is what the comprehensive rule says about uniqueness:

When a unique card is in play and currently active, you cannot play another card that has the same title.

If you play 7R152 first, you do not have a unique Mumak Commander in play and active, so it would surely appear that you can play another card with that title. If, however, you played 15R86 first, then you clearly would not be able to then play 7R152 because they have the same title.

Assuming that's true, then yes you could exert 7R152 twice using the ability on 15R86 because the latter says 'Exert Mumak Commander twice' which includes any card with the title 'Mumak Commander'.

Thranduil

[FingolfinFinwe]

Ok that's sick.  Makes sense though, That's how I'd play it.

[Elessar's Socks]

What I was expecting to see: "You cannot play a card that has the same title as another card in play and currently active if one of them is unique."

Which as Thranduil pointed out isn't what the the rulebook actually says: "When a unique card is in play and currently active, you cannot play another card that has the same title."

And also the example given by the rulebook supports the second: "You may have only one card with the card title of •Gandalf in play at one time."

Even though I wasn't expecting this, it does seem like Mumak Commander GAtS can be played after RotK Mumak Commander.

What does Bib have to say?

And even if you could, whenever a card refers to itself by name, it means that specific object, so the ability of a Mumak Commander could only be used to exert that specific Mumak Commander. Not sure I'm making myself clear enough...

I remember MtG states this rule explicitly, but I don't think there's an equivalent rule in LotR.

[FM]

Yeah, I think it would've gotten to that eventually, but the game ended up dying before this could come up, so, unfortunately, it seems it works as Thranduil pointed, since no more ruling updates will be made to the game.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

So remind me again why they printed a unique card with the same title as a non-unique card? *shakes head*

[SomeRandomDude]

So remind me again why they printed a unique card with the same title as a non-unique card? *shakes head*

Because their name is "Decipher Inc."

[mister_moe]

hallo, even though there is a different question.... WHAT DO YOU WANT WITH A MUMAL COMMANDER  from Rotk?

<Offensive part was removed. We do not tolerate offensive behavior toward fellow forumers, no matter how strongly you feel about a subject. If you can't say it in a polite way, don't say it at all.>~FM

[TheJord]

mister_moe none of your comments were very constructive. Either help out with the question, or if you want to go on about Mumak Commander being a crap card, do it in a civilized way