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Author Topic: A Quest for a Culture - Ring-bound Rangers.  (Read 11147 times)

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August 20, 2009, 01:04:18 AM
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menace64

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A Quest for a Culture - Ring-bound Rangers.
« on: August 20, 2009, 01:04:18 AM »
I'm going to steal an old mechanic from SWCCG and graft it into LotR. Enjoy.

[4] Orc Invoker [Sauron]
Minion • Orc
Strength-9
Vitality-2
Site Number-6
When you play this minion, you may exert it to take an insert condition into hand from your draw deck.

[2] Sown Doubt [Sauron]
Condition • Insert
Resistance -3
To play, exert a [Sauron] Orc. Insert into the Free Peoples player's draw deck. When this condition is revealed, transfer it to a companion (except the Ring-bearer). Discard this condition when the Free Peoples player reconciles.
The Free Peoples player may not play skirmish events during skirmishes involving bearer.

[1] Stray But a Little [Sauron]
Condition • Insert
To play, spot 3 [Sauron] conditions. Insert into the Free Peoples player's draw deck. When this condition is revealed, transfer it to the Ring-bearer. Discard this condition at the start of the regroup phase if no companion lost a skirmish at this site.
Each time a companion loses a skirmish, add 2 burdens.

The rule entry regarding 'insert' a card would be: 'place randomly and face-up into the opponent's draw deck and shuffle that deck. If an inactive insert card is revealed, shuffle it back into the same draw deck.' Since a player normally does most of his card-drawing at the end of his turn, these suckers would normally land in the regroup and be around for the whole of the next turn. It would give all players a little bit of time to prepare for the impact.

What do you think?
« Last Edit: July 23, 2020, 03:45:38 PM by menace64 »

August 20, 2009, 04:23:25 AM
Reply #1

FM

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2009, 04:23:25 AM »
Sleeves would greatly mess up the randomness of this, and playing without sleeves and handing MY cards to someone ELSE shuffle without sleeves, is just... ew. I like the idea, but dislike the possibility of actually executing it.

August 20, 2009, 05:16:12 AM
Reply #2

Elrohir

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2009, 05:16:12 AM »
You know, if you draw a card, it is not revealed. Is not it?
You gave away your life's grace. I cannot protect you anymore.

August 20, 2009, 07:10:47 AM
Reply #3

DáinIronfoot

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2009, 07:10:47 AM »
Quote from: menace64
[4] Orc Invoker [Sauron]
Minion • Orc
Strength-9
Vitality-2
Site Number-6
When you play this minion, you may exert it to take an insert condition into hand from your draw deck.
Okay.... I need to read on, I s'pose.

Quote from: menace64
[2] Sown Doubt [Sauron]
Condition • Insert
Resistance -3
To play, exert a [Sauron] Orc. Insert into the Free Peoples player's draw deck. When this condition is revealed, transfer it to a companion (except the Ring-bearer). Discard this condition when the Free Peoples player reconciles.
The Free Peoples player may not play skirmish events during skirmishes involving bearer.
Probably should say "revealed or drawn", just to cover all your ambiguous bases. And who does the actual transferring here, the FP player or the owner of this card?

I think it's probably fine at [1] since it discards shortly after being played anyway.

Quote from: menace64
[1] Stray But a Little [Sauron]
Condition • Insert
To play, spot 3 [Sauron] conditions. Insert into the Free Peoples player's draw deck. When this condition is revealed, transfer it to the Ring-bearer. Discard this condition at the start of the regroup phase if no companion lost a skirmish at this site.
Each time a companion loses a skirmish, add 2 burdens.
Ouch! This one, on the other hand, needs to cost more. At least [2], and probably [3].

Quote from: menace64
The rule entry regarding 'insert' a card would be: 'place randomly and face-up into the opponent's draw deck and shuffle that deck. If an inactive insert card is revealed, shuffle it back into the same draw deck.' Since a player normally does most of his card-drawing at the end of his turn, these suckers would normally land in the regroup and be around for the whole of the next turn. It would give all players a little bit of time to prepare for the impact.

What do you think?
Oh, face-up. Probably okay to leave out the "or drawn" thing I recommended, then. Other than the physical issues Felipe pointed out, I like this idea a lot. Lots of potential. :gp:
Best regards,
Dáin


Check out Lasting Alliances and The Road Ahead, my two completed DC sets, and also The Way Into Mordor (in progress), all part of my 5-set Wars of the Ring DC "block".

August 20, 2009, 03:34:25 PM
Reply #4

Thranduil

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2009, 03:34:25 PM »
I don't like the name insert. Something about spying or infiltrating?

Thranduil

August 21, 2009, 12:50:22 AM
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menace64

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2009, 12:50:22 AM »
I hadn't considered giving the mechanic a new name, but if I return to that area I'll come up with something more LotRsy.

I reckon this has been done before, but let's go and do an objective or two. And, now that I'm conscious of it, they're called quests!

(0) We Seek the Halls of Durin [Dwarven]
Quest (Front)
Your Ring-bearer must be a Dwarf. Your starting fellowship must include at least one other Dwarf.
For remainder of game, the only companions you may play are Dwarves. Non-[Dwarven] events, conditions, and followers are twilight cost +2.
While this side up, each Dwarf is resistance -1 for each artifact he bears. Each time the fellowship moves, you may exert a Dwarf to play a Dwarf from your draw deck.
Flip this quest when the fellowship moves to an underground site in region 2 or 3 (or any site in region 2 or 3 if you spot 6 Dwarf companions).

[7] What We Awoke in the Darkness [Dwarven]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, each time you stack a card on your [Dwarven] condition, you may stack an additional card from your discard pile onto that condition. Once during each skirmish involving your Dwarf, you may discard a card from hand with 'Durin' in title to make that Dwarf damage +1. Each time a Shadow player plays a minion of strength 15 or greater, add 2 threats. Each time your Dwarf wins a skirmish against a minion of strength 15 or greater, remove a threat, and you may discard a card from hand to draw a card.
Flip this quest if, when the first Shadow player reconciles, there are more minions than Dwarf companions.

The purpose of quests is to speed up gameplay and to help define cohesive strategies. Yes it's power-creep. Duh. By their very presence they spike the power lever of other cards. The idea is to provide each culture with their own useful quest.

This one I wrote for [Dwarven] highlights their journey back to the Mines of Moria and their subsequent war against the goblins and the Balrog. I'm pretty tired so I'm sure I overlooked one or two thematic elements that should appear here. And, yes, I purposefully wrote into the first few lines a way to fit a non-Dwarf companion or two into the fellowship. If you can manage it, you can play Aragorn, Strider or maybe even a few Hobbits (or Smeagol even).

I'll crank out some more later on. I just had soup which means I need to go sleep.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 03:16:22 PM by menace64 »

August 21, 2009, 04:24:46 AM
Reply #6

Thranduil

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2009, 04:24:46 AM »
(0) We Seek the Halls of Durin [Dwarven]
Quest (Front)
Your Ring-bearer must be a Dwarf. Your starting fellowship must include at least one other Dwarf.
For remainder of game, you may play only Dwarf companions. Non-[Dwarven] events, conditions, and followers are twilight cost +2.
While this side up, each Dwarf is resistance -1 for each artifact he bears. Each time the fellowship moves, you may exert a Dwarf to play a Dwarf from your draw deck.
Flip this quest when the fellowship moves to an underground site in region 2 or 3 (or any site in region 2 or 3 if you spot 6 Dwarf companions).
I loved objectives! They were awesome. I would remove the parentheses.

[7] What We Awoke in the Darkness [Dwarven]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, each time you stack a card on your [Dwarven] condition, you may stack an additional card from your discard pile onto that condition. Once during each skirmish involving your Dwarf, you may discard a card from hand with 'Durin' in title to make that Dwarf damage +1. Each time a Shadow player plays a minion of strength 15 or greater, add 2 threats. Each time your Dwarf wins a skirmish against a minion of strength 15 or greater, remove a threat, and you may discard a card from hand to draw a card.
Flip this quest if, when the first Shadow player reconciles, there are more minions than Dwarf companions.
Simply awesome! Though I'm not sure about having both strength 15 texts... I understand your twilight cost is making fun of destiny, but do you imagine that when you flip it you'll add [7] to the pool?

Thranduil

August 21, 2009, 07:50:25 AM
Reply #7

DáinIronfoot

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Re: This Should Be Fun.
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2009, 07:50:25 AM »
Quote from: menace64
(0) We Seek the Halls of Durin [Dwarven]
Quest (Front)
Your Ring-bearer must be a Dwarf. Your starting fellowship must include at least one other Dwarf.
For remainder of game, you may play only Dwarf companions. Non-[Dwarven] events, conditions, and followers are twilight cost +2.
While this side up, each Dwarf is resistance -1 for each artifact he bears. Each time the fellowship moves, you may exert a Dwarf to play a Dwarf from your draw deck.
Flip this quest when the fellowship moves to an underground site in region 2 or 3 (or any site in region 2 or 3 if you spot 6 Dwarf companions).

Yeah, I always wanted to try cards like this. I actually made a few similar ones for my now-mostly-defunct Halo TCG (they had win and lose, but I like your overalll idea better with the flip thing. :up: I'm assuming these play to the support area, and play from the start of the game along with your starting fellowship?

One could potentially read this as meaning the only cards you can play at all are Dwarf companions...no events, conditions, etc. Just to clean that up, perhaps change it to "...the only companions you may play are Dwarves." Question: does that remain in effect regardless of which side is up?

Personally, I'd leave the text in parenthesis...Thran has a parenthesis phobia. :P I think it's fine as is.

Quote from: menace64
[7] What We Awoke in the Darkness [Dwarven]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, each time you stack a card on your [Dwarven] condition, you may stack an additional card from your discard pile onto that condition. Once during each skirmish involving your Dwarf, you may discard a card from hand with 'Durin' in title to make that Dwarf damage +1. Each time a Shadow player plays a minion of strength 15 or greater, add 2 threats. Each time your Dwarf wins a skirmish against a minion of strength 15 or greater, remove a threat, and you may discard a card from hand to draw a card.
Flip this quest if, when the first Shadow player reconciles, there are more minions than Dwarf companions.

I'm tempted to really go nuts and do burdens instead of threats. That would actually be feasible since this doesn't require a Dwarf-only fellowship, so you could include ways to remove burdens (other than just the win-a-skirmish-triggered ability here). It's fine as is, though.
Best regards,
Dáin


Check out Lasting Alliances and The Road Ahead, my two completed DC sets, and also The Way Into Mordor (in progress), all part of my 5-set Wars of the Ring DC "block".

August 21, 2009, 03:15:38 PM
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menace64

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Re: This Should Be Fun - Welcome to Questburger.
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2009, 03:15:38 PM »
Yeah, the (0) and [7] are just to help differentiate front from back, and yes quests start the game in play.

I knew that 'only Dwarf companions' bit would end up being the less-than-ideal wording; changes made. And yes, any text with For preceding it is in effect regardless of what side of the quest happens to be up. The For bit sets parameters for the entire length of the game.

Now for a Shadow quest:

(0) The World is Changing [Isengard]
Quest (Front)
Draw 7 cards instead of 8 for your starting hand. Then, take any Saruman minion into hand from your draw deck.
For remainder of game, Orcs are strength -2. Each time you play a unique minion, each player shuffles a random card from his or her discard pile into his or her draw deck. Your [Uruk] hand weapons may be played on [Isengard] Uruk-hai.
While this side up, at the end of each of your Shadow phases, you may exert your Uruk-hai to play a machine from your draw deck. Machines with [Isengard] tokens on them may not be discarded by Free Peoples cards.
Flip this quest if you spot 6 or more [Isengard] tokens on machines.

[7] Stained With the Blood of Rohan [Isengard]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, each time a companion is placed in the dead pile, add a threat. Characters bearing a hand weapon are strength +1, and each time your non-unique Uruk-hai bearing a hand weapon wins a skirmish, you may transfer that hand weapon to another Uruk-hai. Each time your machine is discarded by its own game text, you may take that machine into hand (and, if you spot Saruman, you may exert him to play that machine).
Flip this quest if you cannot spot a machine or if a site is liberated.

Another cool perk to having quests is they can singlehandedly breathe life into dying strategies, like [Isengard] machines in this case. There's a lot of inherent power in machine decks, but just not enough support or protection. This offers both, but always at a price. Orcs suck worse, and a lot of your benefits can easily be used by the Free Peoples player. Also, those machines are only immune to discard on the front side; I wanted that to be the case to better illustrate the swinging of battle.

And, yes, this quest was written with Berserkers in mind. To pull a machine each turn you need to exert an Uruk. How beneficial for them! And being able to transfer hand weapons between Berserkers is quite handy. The [Uruk] line was inserted specifically for Berserker Torch, which may or may not be taking things too far (+4 strength *per* wound?).

I think the next culture I write a quest for is going to be [Gandalf], but don't you dare quote me saying that.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 06:57:08 PM by menace64 »

August 21, 2009, 06:42:29 PM
Reply #9

DáinIronfoot

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Re: This Should Be Fun - Welcome to Questburger.
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2009, 06:42:29 PM »
Quote from: menace64
(0) The World is Changing [Isengard]
Quest (Front)
Draw 7 cards instead of 8 for your starting hand. Then, take any Saruman minion into hand from your draw deck.
For remainder of game, Orcs are strength -2. Each time you play a unique minion, each player shuffles a random card from his or her discard pile into his or her draw deck. Your [Uruk] hand weapons may be played on [Isengard] Uruk-hai.
While this side up, at the end of each of your Shadow phases, you may exert your Uruk-hai to play a machine from your draw deck. Machines with [Isengard] tokens on them may not be discarded by Free Peoples cards.
Flip this quest if you spot 6 or more [Isengard] tokens on machines.

The Orc thing is interesting. You're not likely to use them with all-out Uruks anyway, but it helps control potential toss-ins. LOVE the [Uruk] / [Isengard] connection...that almost makes this worth it by itself! Liking the machine love, too. :up:

Quote from: menace64
[7] Stained With the Blood of Rohan [Isengard]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, each time a companion is placed in the dead pile, add a threat. Characters bearing a hand weapon are strength +1, and each time your non-unique Uruk-hai bearing a hand weapon wins a skirmish, you may transfer that hand weapon to another Uruk-hai. Each time your machine is discarded by its own game text, you may take that machine into hand (and, if you spot Saruman, you may exert him to play that machine).
Flip this quest if you cannot spot a machine.

Like it, like it. My only concern is the potential to replay that machine right away. I assume tokens would be removed, which makes most machines okay to replay again right away, but what about Devilry of Orthanc? Get enough other machines out with tokens on them, discard DoO to exert every character, replay it right away, rinse and repeat to exhaust EVERY character. Yikes. I think it's good to tie in Saruman with this somehow, but I think it needs to be something else. Maybe exert him to reinforce a token on another machine instead?

Quote from: menace64
I think the next culture I write a quest for is going to be [Gandalf], but don't you dare quote me saying that.

Consider that quoted. I've printed it out and hung it on my wall. TWICE.
Best regards,
Dáin


Check out Lasting Alliances and The Road Ahead, my two completed DC sets, and also The Way Into Mordor (in progress), all part of my 5-set Wars of the Ring DC "block".

August 21, 2009, 06:56:50 PM
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menace64

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Re: A Quest for a Culture - Uruk's Get Sharper Teeth.
« Reply #10 on: August 21, 2009, 06:56:50 PM »
The idea behind taking machines back into hand (and possibly playing them immediately again) is because that's one of the primary problems behind machine decks. They run out of steam and/or just can't draw into what they need. I know it's a potentially powerful ability, but consider that you first have to get the quest flipped to even have it become an eligible possibility.

And to play it again, you need Saruman around with spare vitality; so it isn't likely to happen consistently.

I do see the need to make the back side of this quest flip to the front a little easier. With that in mind, I added: "or if a site is liberated." Like I said, in a well-built machine deck, 6 tokens is pretty easy cake. I'd like this quest to flip a lot.

August 21, 2009, 10:32:53 PM
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menace64

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Re: A Quest for a Culture - Theoden Lives!
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2009, 10:32:53 PM »
I'd like to try writing a quest that actually involves a specific event taking place. So let's see what happens:

(0) Too Long Has He Sat in Shadow [Gandalf]
Quest (Front)
Place Theoden out of play with 3 leechcraft tokens on him (while out of play, you may not play Theoden). Your starting fellowship must include Gandalf.
While this side up, at the start of each fellowship phase, you may exert Gandalf to play Gandalf's Staff or Shadowfax from your draw deck. [Rohan] companions are resistance -1, and minions skirmishing them are strength +1. Each time Gandalf wins a skirmish or a [Gandalf] card removes a threat, remove a leechcraft token from Theoden. During any shadow phase, a Shadow player may exert his or her Saruman twice to add a leechcraft token to Theoden.
Flip this quest if there are no leechcraft tokens on Theoden.

[7] As Poison is Drawn From the Wound [Gandalf]
Quest (Back)
Immediately transfer Theoden from out of play and into the fellowship. Play Herugrim and/or King's Mail from your draw deck.
While this side up, Theoden may not be overwhelmed, Gandalf is resistance +2, and each time a unique [Rohan] companion wins a skirmish, you may exert Gandalf twice to liberate a site. [Rohan] companions bearing unique possessions are damage +1 and valiant. [Rohan] fortifications are twilight cost -1, and may not be discarded by Shadow players unless that Shadow player first removes [4].
Place this quest out of play if Theoden is killed.

This is a [Rohan]-centric quest focused on Gandalf. I figure the majority of [Gandalf] quests would be like this - you use his powers to vastly improve the performance of another culture. Rather obviously, the goal is to cure Theoden and then ride out to battle. You get tons of benefits once you flip, but if things go south and Theoden bites it you're left without a quest at all.

Yes I realize that this isn't as popular a dream card format for most of you. That's fine. I'm going to keep posting these things, reviews or not, until I feel like I have nothing else to design. Just tell me if it sucks!
« Last Edit: August 23, 2009, 12:54:02 AM by menace64 »

August 22, 2009, 09:01:11 AM
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DáinIronfoot

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Re: A Quest for a Culture - Uruk's Get Sharper Teeth.
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2009, 09:01:11 AM »
You know, I was going to break this down and review it piece by piece, but I really don't see any flaws. I'd LOVE this with Gandalf BoO or Gandalf LoM, especially. The extra resistance offered to Gandalf by the back side makes this very intriguing with BoO.

Perhaps one fun tweak you could make: "[Rohan] companions and Wizards bearing unique possessions are damage +1 and valiant." :up:
Best regards,
Dáin


Check out Lasting Alliances and The Road Ahead, my two completed DC sets, and also The Way Into Mordor (in progress), all part of my 5-set Wars of the Ring DC "block".

August 22, 2009, 01:22:48 PM
Reply #13

Thranduil

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Re: A Quest for a Culture - Theoden Lives!
« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2009, 01:22:48 PM »
I would second DI's suggestion. I wonder if it's worth allowing more minions than just Saruman to get leechcraft counters on. Perhaps unique minions? Not sure.

I'd like to see a [Gandalf] quest for the Fellowship of the Ring!

Thranduil

August 23, 2009, 12:53:12 AM
Reply #14

menace64

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Re: A Quest for a Culture - Murderers!
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2009, 12:53:12 AM »
I've been giving that quest some thought, Thrandy. It's not going to be written for a while, but I assure you I will attempt it.

But tonight I need to make a Shadow quest. My first instinct is to do [Gollum]. Naahhhh. I've got something stupider to do:

(0) The Horsemen Took Your Lands! [Dunland]
Quest (Front)
Take 3 non-unique [Dunland] minions of strength 7 or less into hand from your draw deck; your starting hand is 3 cards less.
For remainder of game, each time you take control of a site, you may discard a [Dunland] Man to add a threat.
While this side up, at the start of your shadow phase, you may shuffle 2 [Dunland] Men from hand into your draw deck to play a [Dunland] condition or [Dunland] support area possession from your draw deck. The Free Peoples player must first add [3] to liberate a site. Each Free Peoples fortification is twilight cost +1.
Flip this quest if the number of sites you control and cards in the dead pile totals 5 or more.

[7] We Will Die For Saruman [Dunland]
Quest (Back)
While this side up, threats may not be removed by Free Peoples cards. Each time a [Dunland] Man wins a skirmish, you may discard that Man to make the Free Peoples player wound a companion or discard 2 Free Peoples cards from hand. Each time you play a [Dunland] Man from a site you control, you may take a [Dunland] Man into hand from your discard pile.
Flip this quest if you cannot spot a [Dunland] Man and the fellowship moves during the regroup phase.

I reworded the pre-game hand-builder because it dawned on me that one deck can actually run two quests: one FP and one Shadow. Under this kind of wording, it just subtracts from the starting hand size.

Pretty simple stuff, really. Brings [Dunland] up to speed by adding in threats, and gives them a few more punches against current fellowships. If you manage the flip, you can really bring the hammer down: playing a minion from a controlled site nets you a minion back into your hand, and a lot of [Dunland] minions can play directly from your hand during a skirmish. So that's two-for-one, and if those happen to be a copy or two of Dunlending Elder... heh. Woe to the Strawheads!