Sauron Besiegers swarm. (shadow only)

[alehaak]

Shadow (35)
2x *Encirclement (7R268)
2x *Tower Walkway (7C315)
3x *Troop Tower (7R316)
4x Great Siege-towers (7U281)
3x Some Secret Art of Flame (7C313)
2x Their Marching Companies (8U107)
3x Din of Arms (7R267)
3x *Troll of Gorgoroth, Abomination of Sauron (8R108)
4x Gorgoroth Berserker (8R96)
2x Gorgoroth Keeper (10C86)
4x Olog-Hai of Mordor (8R105)
3x Siege Troop (8C106)

I don't know what to do here... the main idea is the famous (?!) besieger swarm... but isn't working...
help!

[Elrohir]

Although I like to play besiegers, it is hard to tell you how to play them to "moriazise" the free-people-players ringbearer.

Here are my suggestios:

+2 Gorgoroth swarm
+ Above the battlement
+2 Gorgoroth Agitator
+2 Gorgoroth Assassin
-1 Troop Tower
-1 Some Secret Art of Flame
-2 Gorgoroth Berserker
-1 Ologhai of Mordor
-2 Great Siege Towers

Alternatives: Gothmog, Gothmogs Warg, Grond

for Expanded: Dead Marshes, Grishnak, Goblin Runner, Forces of Mordor ....

[Elessar's Socks]

Besiegers have so many card choices. I guess my builds are determined in large part by the condition removal present in the environment. I think you can build a mean Troll swarm in Movie block (pack a full set of Great Hill Troll, and maybe copies of Terrible as the Dawn to knock out Lady Redeemed), but in Expanded the engines might not remain too long on the table.

Not sure how normal this is, but I like to ramp up on threats using a Gollum engine. Site control is mostly handled by Gorgoroth Berserker (ditching Siege Troop completely) and Troop Tower. Then with the help of Gorgoroth Troop and Their Marching Companies, stack whatever Besiegers you can until you're ready to swarm. Gorgoroth Agitator replays Troop Tower and TMC if they were discarded earlier, and a whole bunch of minions comes down with the additional aid of Encirclement and Ithil Stone. If you're at Cavern Entrance, hopefully the minions on the Ring-bearer are enough for an overwhelm. If not, then use Gorgoroth Troop to restack besiegers for Troop Tower until the strength on the Ring-bearer is maximized. Kind of difficult to play, but it can result in some nice swarms.

Oh, and Gorgoroth Soldier is a really good card. Wound prevention can turn the tide, and he makes a good early drop with Troop Tower.

[King89]

i just counted 16 minions... not enough to swarm a good fellowship ;-)

[Pepin The Breve]

   I have a Besigers deck although a don´t run a threat engine on it. Basically i just play a lot of engines, control some sites and stack people on it. If your opponent don´t run mass condition discard (with Gandy for example), don´t liberate sites or don´t discard all your minions at regroup (with Smeagol RB for example) soon you will have a bunch of fierce big minions at the table and i can tell: they can do a lot of damage...

   I tend to stay away from packing too much minions that need spoting a sauron orc or are just too expensive...

   My suggestions:
- add Gorgoroth Assasin - He is very cheap and his hability can be just a finisher for your opponent if he/she don´t play with ringbound-people, cause you can both aim him on a weak almost dead character or put him in the strongest one while your big trolls overwhelm the other guys. You can also put two on the same companion... 
- If you are playing movie block definitly add Great Hill Troll, he discard conditions and can be a cheap big fierce fat minion when you have enough engines at table (and don´t need any spotting to play...)
- I don´t have time right now but later i can post my deck here...the main difference is that i pack more cheaper minion and less condition (i learn that few minions with guys that need spotting to play is almost certain that you will get your hand clogged) and i go for stacking them at sites to abuse Troop Tower (don´t forget Gorgoroth Pillager  ).

[Pepin The Breve]

i just counted 16 minions... not enough to swarm a good fellowship ;-)

   You can "swarm" a good fellowship with 4 or 5 big fierce minions   

[SomeRandomDude]

Not really, actually. You do need more minions. Drop Some Secret Art of Flame, you have it for what, 1 minion? Not worth it. Same with Great Siege Towers. Not worth it. Gorgoroth Agitator, however, PWNS, especially with Great Peril of Fire. So add 4. I'd also drop the Olog-Hai and the Berserker because they're too pricey. Add 11 cheaper minions, including some that are unabashed swarm minions. Gorgoroth Sapper? 4 copies. 2 more Gorgoroth Keeper. Gorgoroth Pillager x 2, et cetera.

I'd even toss in some Dunlending Elder.

[Elrohir]

You can also put two on the same companion... 

Characters who are already assigned, may not be assigned by an assignment special ability - but I like Gorgoroth Assassin 

Try Orc Pursuer - if you have initiative anyway...-very nice, if encirclement reduces his costs to zero! That is cheap swarm!

[leokula]

After playing with and aggainst this deck hundreds of times, I know how to build it almost by heart.

First, drop 1x tower walkway and add 1x Troop tower. Troop tower is the key card to this deck, you need four cause you can't be afraid to discard it to take control of a site. The sooner you control the first site, the sooner you start stacking your guys and then the fun starts. Remember, with besiegers it doesn't matter that much how many sites you control, but how many stacked guys you have, cause that will give you strength bonus and will help you drop your ologs. They HAVE to come free and all at once. If someone tells you not to play 4x Ologs it's because this someone never played besiegers and have no idea what they're talking about

@NB: Olog too pricey? LMAO congrats NB, another very useful post u clearly have no idea what a besieger deck is like and yet ur trying to teach someone! 

@King98: Not enough minions? LMAO this is not Moria not Forest Nazguls, sorry... we can all count minions, so if you can't add something else, just leave it 

Drop all Great Siege-towers, Some Secret Art of Flame and Their Marching Companies... just slow and unefficient in this deck, forget them. Forget about the berserker too, and forget about threats... it's not what besiegers are all about, unless you want to do your own version of besiegers, but seems like urs is not working and you want one that works

This deck focus on (in this order):
.controlling sites
.stacking guys
.playing, ALL AT ONCE, 4x ologs for free + keepers stacked + minions in your hand + minions you play after olog wins

For controlling sites:
1x Tower Walkway
4x Troop Tower
4x Siege Troop
4x Din of Arms

For stacking guys:
3x Gorgoroth Keeper - perfect, stacks and plays later on the swarm
3x Gorgoroth Breaker - Seems odd at first, but you'll always stack him and it means +1 for all your guys for each breaker stacked.
2x Gorgoroth Troop - Stacks plus helps eventual overwhelming. Use him to stack keepers if u see they won't survive until regroup. Pretty much stack everything u can, actually :hey:
2x Gorgoroth Pillager - This was my latest addition since it raised deck size to 37... this is how my brother plays and the pillager stacked makes a #$&*@! of a difference... anyway, if you wanna keep under 35, I think he's the one that should be cut.
4x Gorgoroth Assassin - multi functional usually just assign him to anybody, makes sure he survives, discard him and troop tower to take a site, that's how he works... later, use him on the swarm to fight the big guy and let the ologs free. I have had my Cirdan fight him inumerous times while other ologs were eating my companions alive 

And finally...
4x Olog-hai of mordor - The star of the deck 
2x Encirclement
2x Ithil Stone
2x Grond, Hammer of the Underworld

To a total of 35 or 37 cards. I think this is the correct way to play besiegers. This deck IS slow, you need a fellowship good enough to hold until you have the bomb, but the bomb is so huge, it's ridiculous: you'll be playing 4 ologs for free, plus all keepers stacked plus all minions in your hand, and as ologs win, you play more besiegers... with 4 stacked minions and 3 sites controlled, all your besiegers are +7 and fierce if pillager is stacked.

Did I say I love them?

[TheJord]

Sounds like you know what you are talking leokula!

[Elrohir]

I think, we are all convinced what we are talking about 

If anyone wants to know how my besiegers work, I will list them. Problem is: they do not swarm, so it might not fit to this topic.

Leokula: you are right, but king89 is also right. It depends on which strategy you try to win. I play 30 cards (20 minions)

[leokula]

thanx tj! i don't want to sound like a tool but i DO know what i'tm talking about from being beat by this deck over and over lol

Sure elhoir, i know that minion count is very relevant In a swarm deck, its just that sometimes when someone asks for help, they're usually expecting more than "play more minions"

[Gate Troll]

Sounds like you know what you are talking leokula!

I think, we are all convinced what we are talking about 

Well, of course everyone's convinced about what they are talking about. Duh. 
I think he means that leokula has experience with this deck type. English isn't your first language is it? 

[Elessar's Socks]

Hmm... this is the build I'm using for Moria-esque swarming:

32 cards.

1 Gollum, Old Villain
3 Gorgoroth Agitator
3 Gorgoroth Berserker
4 Gorgoroth Keeper
4 Gorgoroth Soldier
2 Gorgoroth Swarm
3 Gorgoroth Troop

1 Ithil Stone

1 Encirclement
1 Fat One Wants It
2 Their Marching Companies
3 Troop Tower

4 Captured by the Ring

Against mass wounding, Gollum soaks undirected wounds, Gorgoroth Soldier eats directed wounds, and threats generally interfere with some of the nastier cards like the Silvan brothers and Aragorn's Bow, Ranger's Longbow. It stinks if Shadowplay blocks the Berserker (I guess you could tech by playing Gothmog's Warg next if the FP player was careless), but that's what Troop Tower is for.

I do like the Berserker better than the Siege Troop for site control, since the former takes control of a site in an earlier phase (you can begin stacking the same site), and that's also fewer phases for the FP to cause problems.

Forgot to mention Gorgoroth Swarm earlier. Great against mass fellowships by retrieving discarded besiegers, plus extra controlled sites in the Shadow phase.

Pair it with a fellowship that cycles well so you can get sites early and stack early.

[SomeRandomDude]

Leokula...I'm not the most familiar with besiegers, but I was under the impression he was trying to build a straightforward swarm deck such as Moria, which is also a competitive variant of the Sauron besieger deck, though not the classic. So I was trying to help him out with that. So you play a different style. SO WHAT? If you want a typical besieger deck, I need to introduce you to friend of mine who runs besiegers that can beat the tar out of your deck. Let's just say...wtf no Gothmog? But if you're going to post as a different variant of besiegers, I recommend a different topic.

Also, I don't mind you getting ticked off at me, you seem to have some chip under your shoulder about my posts (BTW, I will take you on sometime at SdA and see who has the last laugh), but please at least try to be respectful to other people. If you feel that other people don't have your amazing expertise and deck-building skills, don't run 'em off. LotR is for all kinds of players and some people are more familiar than others. And BTW, representing the swarm deck we were talking about, and the thread author posted, 16 minions is NOT enough.

Sweet deck ES. That's a swarm build that can actually produce raw power instead of messing around with tricky plays that could get disrupted easily.