More Virtual Cards (Cruel Caradhras, take II)

[Thranduil]

Not bad, but that strength boost will not provide much of a boost (+2 at most with all followers except the -cost Celebring). Perhaps make it a minimum of a +1 boost--or +1 in addition to the follower's twilight cost--to make it a little nastier.

Well there are also cost followers in the set like Elrond, Gandalf and Aragorn, and more cost followers like Galadriel and Boromir. Do you think it still needs more?

Thranduil

[DáinIronfoot]

Oh, right. Forgot about those. In that case, it's probably fine. So-so when considering the entirety of followers, but quite good within the bounds of your set(S). So yes, that's probably fine. I MIGHT still make it a minimum of +1, though. Maybe.

[Anvar]

Troop of Uruk-hai (V)
Minion • Uruk-hai
Str: 9
Vit: 4
Sit: 5
Bloodlust 2. Damage +1.
When you play this minion, spot another Uruk-hai and a companion with X wounds to make this minion twilight cost -X.
1 V 143

Can't decide if he's too good or not. Could be strength 13ish, at cost 2-3. Or could be str 9, cost 5. Perhaps the fact that he's weak early game makes him balanced.

Hate and Anger (V)
Event • Skirmish
Choose one: exert an Orc to make an Uruk-hai strength +3 and fierce until the regroup phase; or exert an Uruk-hai to make an Orc strength +3 and damage +1.
3 V 53

How about you get rid of the culture entirely? Make it exert both characters to choose one. And surely you do need the 'until the regroup phase' bit.

One of You Must Do This (V)
Event • Shadow
Exert your minion to make each other player discard one of their conditions.
"'And if we fail, what then? What happens when Sauron takes back what is his?'"
3 V 63

Isn't this a case of 'ALL of you must do this'? My inclination is that it could simply spot the minion and make all players discard a condition, ie you as well.

All in all, nice cards.

Anvar

[Thranduil]

I've made some changes. But now it's back onto those weather cards. This will be an entirely new strategy and an entirely new approach to Shadow sides. The first thing to get your head around is that it need feature only a single minion: Saruman. Obviously, this minion cannot be assigned to skirmishes or take wounds during the archery phase...

So I guess the obvious question is: how do you win if you have a deck which can't skirmish? The answer is, more or less: you don't. The purpose of a weather deck is to screw over your opponent's Free Peoples side so much that they have no Shadow cards to play against your running fellowship! So let's see some examples, and I hope that the strategy will work. It's an experiment, so let's see what you think about this.

Caradhras Has Not Forgiven Us (V)
Event • Maneuver
Spell. Weather.
Exert Saruman twice to return a companion and all cards borne by that companion to the Free Peoples player's hand.
1 V 123

A simple card to start with. This is the most obvious way messing around with a FP side can destroy a Shadow strategy - by hand clog!

Saruman's Frost (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a companion is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that companion.
1 V 135

Saruman's Chill (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a Free Peoples possession or artifact is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that card.
1 V 134

These are examples of encouraging your opponent to keep their Free Peoples cards in their hand or risk corrupting themselves. I chose burdens because there are only a very limited number of burdens any deck can take, as opposed to other things such as twilight or threats. Though, if you think another prevention cost might be more appropriate for the strategy, feel free to suggest it.

Cruel Caradhras (V)
Condition • Support Area
Spell. Weather.
While you can spot Saruman and no minions, the maneuver phase is not skipped.
Regroup: Discard this condition and return Saruman (or Saruman's Reach if you can spot no minions) to your hand to make the move limit -1. The Free Peoples player may add a burden to prevent this.
1 V 124

This card is to get the best out of your copies of Saruman's Reach (V) allowing you to trigger evil sites such as Pellennor Flat without any minions. Just to reiterate, Saruman's Reach (V) does the following:

Saruman's Reach (V)
Condition • Support Area
To play, spot Saruman.
Saruman may be spotted.
Response: If your Shadow card is about to exert Saruman as a cost, discard this condition to pay that cost instead.
1 V 137

Hence the text on Cruel Caradhras about spotting Saruman and no minions. And, just in case you've forgotten, this is Saruman who is suddenly useful in a whole different light. Obviously, the regroup ability doesn't appear to be that useful in this strategy, but that will change in a future post (and to an extent with Cruel Caradhras above).

• Saruman, Keeper of Isengard (V)
Minion • Wizard
Str: 8
Vit: 4
Sit: 4
Saruman may not take wounds during the archery phase and may not be assigned to a skirmish.
When you play Saruman, you may play an condition from your discard pile.
Regroup: Spot another minion to return Saruman to your hand.
3 V 68

This is probably also a good time to remind you of the only weather card we have so far seen:

No Ordinary Storm (V)
Event • Shadow
Weather.
Choose one: reveal 2 weather cards from hand to play Saruman from your draw deck or discard pile; or discard X weather cards from hand and exert Saruman to exert X companions.
"'This is the work of Saruman!'"
1 V 130

[Anvar]

Caradhras Has Not Forgiven Us (V)
Event • Maneuver
Spell. Weather.
Spot Saruman to return a companion and all cards borne by that companion to the Free Peoples player's hand.
1 V 123

Like the idea but this card is way too powerful. Imagine splashing this card into a Dunlending deck with Rabble Rouser. Perhaps you should have to be unable to spot another minion (other than Saruman of course).

Saruman's Frost (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a companion is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that companion.
1 V 135

I think burdens are fair costs for these things.

Saruman's Chill (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a Free Peoples possession or artifact is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that card.
1 V 134

Good.

Cruel Caradhras (V)
Condition • Support Area
Spell. Weather.
While you can spot Saruman and no minions, the maneuver phase is not skipped.
Regroup: Discard this condition and return Saruman (or Saruman's Reach if you can spot no minions) to your hand to make the move limit -1. The Free Peoples player may add a burden to prevent this.
1 V 124

Works.

I guess my only problem with this stuff is that it seems like NPE. Effectively nullifying all your opponents' FP cards, by not ever giving them something to fight, seems really boring for both of you. I think I would prefer this strategy if it involved more minions, or at least some kind of fighting, or perhaps if the cards were designed to work as splashes in other decks rather than as part of a unified strategy. Does that make any sense?

[sickofpalantirs]

I've made some changes. But now it's back onto those weather cards. This will be an entirely new strategy and an entirely new approach to Shadow sides. The first thing to get your head around is that it need feature only a single minion: Saruman. Obviously, this minion cannot be assigned to skirmishes or take wounds during the archery phase...

So I guess the obvious question is: how do you win if you have a deck which can't skirmish? The answer is, more or less: you don't. The purpose of a weather deck is to screw over your opponent's Free Peoples side so much that they have no Shadow cards to play against your running fellowship! So let's see some examples, and I hope that the strategy will work. It's an experiment, so let's see what you think about this.

Caradhras Has Not Forgiven Us (V)
Event • Maneuver
Spell. Weather.
Spot Saruman to return a companion and all cards borne by that companion to the Free Peoples player's hand.
1 V 123
maybe exert saruman?I mean I know grima wormtongue and all but still...

A simple card to start with. This is the most obvious way messing around with a FP side can
Saruman's Frost (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a companion is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that companion.
1 V 135
ditto below.

Saruman's Chill (V)
Condition • Support Area
Weather.
To play, spot Saruman.
Response: If a Free Peoples possession or artifact is played, discard this condition to make the Free Peoples player add a burden or discard that card.
1 V 134
couldn't it be a response event? I would be a little more comofrtable with that...either that or make it unique.


Cruel Caradhras (V)
Condition • Support Area
Spell. Weather.
While you can spot Saruman and no minions, the maneuver phase is not skipped.
Regroup: Discard this condition and return Saruman (or Saruman's Reach if you can spot no minions) to your hand to make the move limit -1. The Free Peoples player may add a burden to prevent this.
1 V 124
why would the maneuver phase be skipped?


Saruman's Reach (V)
Condition • Support Area
To play, spot Saruman.
Saruman may be spotted.
Response: If your Shadow card is about to exert Saruman as a cost, discard this condition to pay that cost instead.
1 V 137
fine

• Saruman, Keeper of Isengard (V)
Minion • Wizard
Str: 8
Vit: 4
Sit: 4
Saruman may not take wounds during the archery phase and may not be assigned to a skirmish.
When you play Saruman, you may play an condition from your discard pile.
Regroup: Spot another minion to return Saruman to your hand.
3 V 68
maybe make the regroup ability, or 2 weather conditions

No Ordinary Storm (V)
Event • Shadow
Weather.
Choose one: reveal 2 weather cards from hand to play Saruman from your draw deck or discard pile; or discard X weather cards from hand and exert Saruman to exert X companions.
"'This is the work of Saruman!'"
1 V 130

fine

[Thranduil]

why would the maneuver phase be skipped?

Because there could be no minions on the table at the end of the Shadow phase in which case you would immediately go to the regroup.

I guess my only problem with this stuff is that it seems like NPE. Effectively nullifying all your opponents' FP cards, by not ever giving them something to fight, seems really boring for both of you. I think I would prefer this strategy if it involved more minions, or at least some kind of fighting, or perhaps if the cards were designed to work as splashes in other decks rather than as part of a unified strategy. Does that make any sense?

I understand what you mean, and I was worried about the same thing. Perhaps I was taking a too theoretical approach to these...

I'd love to hear other opinions, and there might be some in it for people (currently useless I know but it's the thought of it that counts! ). I'll also give gold to SoP and Anvar for their reviews.

Thranduil

[sickofpalantirs]

my question than is, why do you not want the maneuver phase to be skipped/
I;m probably incredibly thick and some combo thats really useful if you have a maneuver phase but no minions hasn't popped out at me yet...buttt

[Anvar]

So you can play things like Caradhras Has Not Forgiven Us, spotting Saruman, but with no minions present.

Anvar

[sickofpalantirs]

I guess *shrugs*